rich did not talk about this too much, but he is up against actually a bunch of regional analysts inside and outside of government who believe their region was i will not go into all of the reason for it, but that is something also where there is a feeling where it affect a lot of the government analysis on it. the third thing i think is really our general use of narrative's, and this is the case inside government. outside government is how we are brought up and how we think. if you are talking about to in asia, i think inherited you would hear in you do here is

this have been largely because behnali did not mobilize the security forces. that was really the surprise. not the understanding about structures and what pressures that brings and really the changing age structure. this is just -- we are not really schooled in banking and these large structural forces -- in thinking about these large structural forces. i do not think we should be ignoring that, and i will talk more about that later, but really in terms -- getting back to strategic foresight, one of the real dilemmas we face, and again it is on discontinuities

the issue. when is this going to happen and where? we ordinarily give long lists to policy makers of pending states or whatever. of course the rightly say which ones and where and when? you cannot deal with 20 or 30, and i do not know what is on the most recent list that we see published in foreign policy, but this has been a long-standing issue. demography, and particularly the way that rich is using it is an extremely valuable tool for this problem. i think what i have actually seen with rich for some time -- i think it is yours. there we go.

technical interference somebody sabotaging. probably one of the analysts we have been talking about. and demography is one of those tools that we can use, and it is just not on this demography issue. i think which has done a lot of other work, and i would like to talk a little bit about the -- rich has done a lot of other work, and i would like to talk a little bit about that. demography is 20 or 30 years. that is why a lot of strategic foresight people have gravitated to it without really knowing as much as rich does with correlation about a lot of other trends, just the fact that you have the certainty in a world of uncertainty. the other than to say is that

demographically speaking, this is an extremely interesting era we are in. in a lot of the problems, excluding egypt, also have a direct relationship with a lot of democratic trends. and also come instability. -- and also instability. rich has done some incredible work on instability and age structure. and we have published materials that he provided on the ark of instability, and if you correlate that with high birthrates, there is an extremely high correlation of that.

we talked about increasing the ark of stability for some of the reasons we have talked about with egypt and tunisia, and that is because in some countries the use olds is beginning to do -- declined or dwindle. a third issue is on the resource question. again, this is something that jeff and the team here have done a lot of work on. in one of the real pressures on water and food resources is on the food demographics side. this in many ways is the demographic age. what i think, going back on and thinking about how do you use

this once you get an understanding, which rich has provided, then as a tool, how do you use it? this is something that rich has put into papers, but did not have a chance to talk about it here, and that is it gives you insight into what is likely to happen. but it is not necessarily destiny -- he gives you insight into what is likely to happen, but it is not necessarily destiny. when we're talking about smooth probablyns, chille is

the model. so it could be a longish transition period. egypt, because of the much more useful population, one out of three chance. we obviously from that have to think about the personalities and have to think about the muslim brotherhood, how we will operate. -- how it will operate. also the personalities where we have a lot of focus and interest in that, and the dynamics

between personalities. this is the key for the business i am in, in terms of understanding the dynamics going forward and being able to provide some foresight, this demographic tool is really essential. what the challenge is for us in government, as well as outside is the understanding more its relationship with these other trends, understanding much more of the dynamics. come back to the first when i say i am not an unbiased supporter. thank you, rich for the work you have done. i do they get has had an impact -- do think it has had an

impact. it does lend a little bit more structure than just our usual narrative's about parties and personalities and individuals. with that, i will conclude. i will be more than happy to pursue any of these issues in our broader discussion. [applause] [captioning performed by national captioning institute] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2011]

>> thank you, gentlemen. you have given us a lot to chew on. certainly a different vision of analysis with what happened with tunisia than what we see in many contexts. noticeably superficial, but we're seeing a recognition of the youthful and rising expectations of the large population as part of the story. we throw it over for questions or comments. as i mentioned, because we are

broadcasting the event, i ask that you wait for my colleague to bring you a microphone. let us know who you are. but start in the middle. >> former wilson center scholar. this is the question not related to tunisia, but demography. i am wondering what work you have done with respect to the issue of gender. that is to say china and india, two bit players have increasingly large male population is relative to the female population, in what regard that has with respect to your projections. >> i must admit i am quite puzzled about its significance. i think it sounds good. i have read valerie hudson's

book, and it is an excellent book. the argument makes lots of sense to appoint, but it deals largely in history- -- makes sense to a point, but it deals partly in history. it is the reference to a period china during the 19th century. this mail skewed structure was blamed for having, as a source of lots of men who positioned themselves outside of the city centers and actually were bandits to a certain extent and extracted taxes.

how applicable this is to present time, i am not so sure it is. and it is hard for me to say, because remember at the same time men are waiting longer to get married, and so are women. or women at mary several times. -- women marry several times. china is not without divorce rates. and i do not know how applicable this is. this assumes that women and men get married at the same age. we know that men get married at older ages than their partner. as they get older, it increases

for men. there is some disparity, but i do not know how applicable it is in the modern sense, and i am not so sure we have seen any of it. a lot of the claims that people have seen some sort of disturbance associated with this are all false as far as i have been able to tell. the wait and see, we are waiting, and seeing, and we are seeing the disparities in marriage age. in fact, there is one in eastern germany going on. it is at the level the chinese disparities will be at in the next decade. the east germany disparity comes from the fact that east german women, upon leaving high school, a sikh college and jobs

elsewhere. elsewhere in europe and the u.s.. -- the east germany disparity comes from the fact that east german women, upon leaving high school, seek college in jobs elsewhere. this can be explained in other ways. that is the case for many european countries. i would not jump to it as causing anything quite frankly right now. >> given your work at u.s.a.i.d. and the issues around trafficking and looking at what are those disparities going to mean in some of these other dynamics we can agree are really important and once we would like to avoid. short of women, the importation

and trafficking of women in terms of bringing in -- >> but look at where trafficking is occurring today. it is more associated with high- income countries -- japan and brides.rea to importwho import those countries do not have a disparity. what does it mean? i do not know what it means, but i think we have jump to conclusions quite a bit. maybe in the end it will pan out some kind of impact. it is a moral issue, and i think that is why people are attracted to it. we wanted to be a security issue, but i think it may not be at all. >> a gentleman over here, and then we will work down to the front >t. nk you.6nank

richard and i have known each other for many years. in that report, youth have become a major factor. we have looked at the current distribution of youth in the muslim majority countries, africa, europe, and the middle east. this is going to increase further to 30% in the next few years. with the exception of few countries, the rates have declined substantially. most of that country's will increase further. i would like to shift from africa to tunisia.

28% of people are youth, a tiny population compared to the region i come from, south asia. in we are about 180 million people in pakistan. that means about 60 million young people. that is more than the combined population of iraq and afghanistan. the question that i was going to raise, although south eastern countries to have some kind of democracy off and on, what would be the role of youth in those countries? 45 millionng about in bangladesh. 55 million to 60 million in pakistan currently. of course india has over 1

billion, so much bigger number. you are talking about a close to-- i do not know, too many. how do you see where the unemployment rate is really high, perhaps 25 percent among young people, what role they play learning the lesson from north africa? that is one question. the second one is what i have seen in my analysis of data that countries that lag behind in the muslim world, and i can identify four or five of them, yemen, afghanistan, and maybe pakistan.

do you think the demography of these countries will react in some way or the other in the near future? thank you. >> ok, this is a difficult question. let me see. self asia is an interesting place, not only for youthfulness but the heritage and democracy. india is interesting because it was of democracy at the end of the colonial period, and it was in charge of an elite -- it was run by as an elite that believe very strongly in democracy. that said, it did what many

young countries do. it dropped from high levels of democracy to something less freedomccording to a breedi house. once during the mrs. gandhi's emergency, and the other time in the 1990's. it has also had bouts of religious violence. as you can see from statistics, it is most difficult in the north where each of those states are the size of countries, and many of them, particularly in the core of the country, and they are just like very useful

countries elsewhere. one can say the same for the french part of pakistan. and we can see that both of those places still have residual -- not residual, but increasing violent insurgencies. the next one is in india. and otherthe calibtaliban small groups in pakistan. south india, on the other hand, is a very peaceful place. the city is also -- the cities also and pakistan and india have advanced in age structure and produce lots of very educated people. so that you have in south asia this divided -- these countries

where the cities are young, and you can have an economy that flourishes almost at the level of a developed economy inside a country that is largely poor and religious and very often very violent. so this is india's reality. you can go to india , and feel like you're very close to the living that you have here, and yet if you fly to another city, you will pass over areas that are very much the developing world, very much like asia to be. i think this is the future for

versouth asia. those that can get educated will come to the cities. unfortunately education is not the strong suit of self asian countries. you look at the budgets, and in the face of population growth, which is still very rapid and pakistan, they're not keeping up. that means they go to religious schools and other schools that are not training them for a profession. what does that mean? it is danger. as far as somalia and sub- saharan africa, the peninsula of some of these countries look like they're older because they have lots of labor coming from asia. they bring in asia from the late 20's, a mid-30's, so that makes

them look older than they are. the native population are very young. the median age is 18 or 19 for bahrain. the native population age structures are very different. we're now looking at a future that is very promising i think. nor are we from middle and upper cut either. any idea that just because there is a lot of young people and it could work, the fact is there is nothing for them and they do not work, and agricultural opportunities are becoming less of an opportunity for the young people. if they are not going to absorb labor, what is?

as one person told me, you just and that is an7 opportunity for some people. and that is sad. >> i think all of those -- not south asia, but we have talked about global trend toward the birth rate remains high. on the other hand, if you do look at the long-term trends on conflict, they do go down, and have been going down in the 1990's. you can correlate that on many more peacekeeping efforts. that does not necessarily mean that it has gotten listed with the country beyond the

minimalist level, but i would not say that they are ordained to collapse into civil war. it does mean, however, i think that for the international community that this will be a long-term effort. one that because of the age structure may have a lot of discouraging results for some time. certainly not quite live up to what we would hope or what our expectations are. >> if i could jump in with a question. you alluded to this briefly, but can you say a word about this commonly held view that is associated with religion in this area and the notion they are like in and not likely to change, i want to ask you about the iran example as an

illustration that runs counter to what is often framed as no change, locked in, in part pointing to the challenges around the status of women and access, but have we seen that as an inevitable and unchangeable situation? >> most people look at iran and they see an islamic republic, but they have no idea that the fertility rate is lower than the united states. it is under 2% probably, and this whole transition occurred after the change in government during the islamic republic. during the iraq/iran war there

was policy of trying to boost the fertility rate. he believed he needed more soldiers and this was good for the nation. when this war ended in 1988, the constitution guaranteed that all would obtain anranians education and health care for free and the finance minister looking at how rapidly the country was growing decided this was impossible, that it would bankrupt the country, the oil industry was in shambles. cameut of the word wood work public health officials who

actually were in the family planning program prior to the revolution, and they were in a program that was sponsored by a u.s.a.i.d. they trained people who knew about family programming and knew how to run services, and that happen to be the run up to the 1994 conference in cairo. there was a lot of thinking in the international community about what a good family planning program would look like. so the coupled up with the finance minister -- they cobbled up with the finance minister and they ran a campaign. they had radio programs for women called in and people argued about whether this was a

good idea for islamic republic to have small family size. within less than two years they had a design for program that they instituted, and it is basically the centralized program where women run health houses with large success. there are other reasons that fertility came down, not only the services, but services are necessary. you also have a very-well educated middle class that has expanded. also, very educated women. women outpace men in educational attainment. the fertility decline was the fastest decline in fertility yet

recorded. if you would look at the age structure, you would see something that is just behind tunisia's. many young people are going through the early part of their adulthood, and you will see some advantages for a while at least, and that is decline in work- force growth that will make it easy for tunisia and iran to employ people. also, you will get this rapid growth in human capital, education, and demographic bonus. probably increases in economic growth, lots of good things will happen for awhile for both iran and tunisian.

>> here and then over here. >> i am a doctoral student in demography of maryland. i very much appreciate this discussion, but i was wondering when you were talking about the rise instability of democracies and how that relates to underline demographics why you excluded levin on. levin on is a liberal democracy. -- lebanon is a liberal democracy. my first question is why you excluded it, and if we put it back into the discussion, how would it inform our understanding of the stability of democracies, especially if we look at it from a demographic perspective that according to the latest u.n. statistics that total fertility rates are as replacements? stinky. thank you. >> if we can come down front and

then go to the gentleman here. you for coming. i have a couple of questions for dr. richard. how do you defined the elite? also, in the country security and the freedom to run against each other. i think in the tunisian case and egypt case, both prove that you are right. tunisia is into 2011, and that is why it is so easy.

but egypt and you say it is 2018, so that means they are not ready yet. that is why i have that difficulty. in my prediction, i think egypt has a long, hard road to go. i think the prospect is not good. you are using freedom house, what is a called freedom index? freedoms course. i do not know much about it, but i do know that that there is a common index in asia. i think you might try to use the index to see what happened, because if i see in tunisia and egypt economy-driven events because there is a lot of

employment. thank you. >> how strong is the domino effect on igniting change in country are route region. ahur --in the surrounding regions. bridget early in countries that have protests on a smaller scale. >> lebanon and the domino effect question. >> according to freedom house it is not a liberal democracy. but it is a good case, because of the use old shop -- the youth

bulge model is says that usefu youthful age structure -- countries are prone to the violence if they have this age structure. when lebanon had the age structure it was in the 1970's. that suggests that it may have been a factor at least with ethnic groups whose fertility transformation have occurred at different paces. if you are familiar with joe work you will notice

that he noted it was going through the democratic so -- demographic transition much christians or jews.ns o it allowed the population to grow at a rate that is more rapid -- i guess everyone is a minority now. [laughter] i think that may have something to do with the ease for which ezbollah has-- his belov been formed. here we have this marginalize population that remains very young, easy to recruit, and meanwhile the country is sort of

suspended in a form of democracy, partial democracy that just cannot make the final jump to very high levels, and that is what i am talking about. when i say that, do not forget the united states did not jump into a liberal democracy. we had a limited franchise for the first 84 years of our existence. revolutions with the intent on getting representation of securing representation of the constitution, violent revolutions very rarely, if ever, and up and high levels of democracy. instead they usually are replaced by partial democracies andworse, another author terr

authoritarian. the model is a tool. i do not take every model as a time when the population will reach liberal democracy. it really is supposed to be a tool with which you can argue people who have an area of perspective or are locked into ideas about personalities and how governments have run and are not observing global trends that may be a work in the country and not evident. i think there are other reasons besides a model to look at tunisia and know it is going to be a liberal democracy.

look at the streets. what you see is a very mixed group. women in the street. older people. the kinds of things to see and color revolution -- you see in revolutions. i would have thought from the model essentially that there would have been more violence. i would think it would have a difficult time getting to a state of liberal democracy like you said. that does not mean it cannot. there is a lot of think that this model does not handled very well. it is up to the egyptian people and how they negotiate the next decade. indonesia took eight years to get there. so let's watch and see. >> that ties to the domino

effect question. i might ask this question on. -- pass this question on. think there is a domino effect. there has been a lot of talk on twitter in facebook, but one of jazzeria rces is algecira and the fact that they have portrayed this as just not individual country revolutions, but a whole of rising throughout the arab world. i think that does have a big part to play, but he go back historically. egypt has always felt it was a leader, and in some sense the fact that to me to have this

revolution before it did, some people see as propelling it towards ousting mubarak, so it is unclear the extent of the domino, but i think we can say from what we know now that there certainly is, and it will continue. >> i do not know anything about that database. what i have said about this age structure is that it attracts a lot of things. when social scientists look at this model, the first thing is and has won a variable, how can that be? -- they say it has one variable, how can that be? it also tracks human capital changes and economic changes, and do not forget that a change

in age structure is affected by economics but they also affect the economics. savings tend to rise. this seems to have a large affect on the countries of east asia, but also ireland and some others. >> we have a lot of questions. let's get to them. >> i am with the public international policy law group. i was wondering in the countries that pass through the age structure transition and either have not survived the democracy or have taken longer, if there is a correlation between wealth and the way to distribute wealth, and the otheer thing would be the rule of law. >> going back a couple of rows. >> my name is steven shore.

i have two questions. how do you explain morocco. as the population structure that much different from tunisia? second, any thought about the future of china based on your model? >> gentleman in the middle. same row. >> afghanistan is shown as in the youthful state. i was wondering how with this demographic affect our attempts to develop a culture of older democracy in that country, and also as well in iraq? 2035 is when they will reach that particular threshold. how with the injection of a liberal democracy culture be affected by this model, and how this model would counter affect that? >> one more.

>> callebs at the united states naval academy. -- caleb at the united states naval academy. i would like to know what you see as your key limiting factors in using this model for analysts were predicting what will happen in the future. >> very good question. >> on rule of law, i do not know anything about it basically. i have tried to limit this to a tool that can easily be by a in the list. what you're talking about are real things on the ground, and i am talking about things i can pull out and make, i do not want

to say a snap judgment, but something that is almost counterintuitive. it is a tool, and as matt said, it is really best in an environment where there are people that are area specialists, people who know a lot about personalities in movements, and then it should be part of the mix. in it really has not become part of the mix, because i think many people are set in their ways. >> can i follow up on this question, because certainly the product is one that has brought these different types of expertise together. i know you have been active in talking to counterparts in other engaging in similarys showi process these. you seeing a rise in this

type of work? how do you see this kind of analysis developing? >> there is quite a bit of recognition. in fact, in may 22, 24, we are holding a conference where we have invited russians, chinese, brazilians, south africans, several different european countries to a conference where we are doing their own global trends. we're going to be doing a public role out of the global trends were you can imagine demography take years quite a bit. so i think this lesson has been learned. i think in part because in some

ways policy makers may be in front of the analyst. and i think at a democratidemogc level they have a better sense. the years we have to know demographics in their party into they are appealing to, but i think there is more in foreign the essence of just a rapidity of change that is happening and the uncertainties. the more you cannot obviously predict what exactly is quinn to happen, but you can give them some sense of the parameters. like i was saying before, a sense of in egypt the chances are one in three. what actually you are up against. that is oftentimes for them very helpful to get that sense of what they need to do or what

they can or cannot do. >> i want to say a word about morocco. >> morocco in 2015 it is post to cross the 50/50 plan. then it will not be that far behind to any ship. having lived in morocco myself, it seems like a very promising place for a transition, perhaps a smooth transition, because as a king who might orchestrate the transition. -- because it has a king who might orchestrate the transition. in thailand that is exactly what happened. i hope that is what happens in morocco. china, it is just a solid authoritarian regime where the

political elites created the commercial a leak in the military elite. the population has matured quite a bit. i do not think it would have any trouble being a liberal democracy if allowed to come up but i do not think the regime will let that happen, and i do not know when it will. >> the models for afghanistan and iraq -- >> what is the message? >> the message is that both of those countries do not have a hard time recruiting. they do not have to recruit from the outside, they can do it from the inside because they have such rapid work force growth. you have young people coming up into the ranks, and even if you think you have destroyed an army

or destroyed some element of it, here they come again. so i suppose the lesson is that if you want to do something in have to doan, you what you have done in iraq. you have to actually recruit those who would be recruited to the other side. you have to win them over. because it is not like bosnia where you destroy an army and then they have trouble finding recruits, they are all over the place. >> if you look at the china example, one reason may be, and there are lots of other reasons why they have more stability then your model predicted, but the regime itself as conscious

that they have to keep producing jobs. that is their number one of the session -- obsession because they are very well aware of your model. [laughter] in some sense they know with what has been a youthful population that unless they keep making the jobs, growing the jobs, that they are in for instability. >> final word on limiting factors. the last question we had. >> too bad that lady left, because she hit on it. where does it work? in countries where there is a divided up population, divided

in terms of ethnic groups. you mentioned afghanistan and iraq, when those ethnic groups declined they are like separate populations. what will happen if one goes first? will it be the same as the lebanese situation? you really have a very segmented population. you have orthodox jews with fertility rates that are extremely high in mortality rates that are very low. they are growing rapidly. you have is really arabs to fertility rates are coming down but still growing rapidly. you have a set of traditional religious and secular jews in the middle that are starting to be eclipsed -- squeezed. it is those people who actually founded the state that we know

of as israel. everywhere there is this divided population, this ethnically divided population, you will have places where it is very difficult to apply the model. the other places are countries that have a lot of deaths from aids. you have this unusual pattern of adult deaths. the other place is immigrant labor. i was mentioning the arabian peninsula, because you look at the age structure and the age structure is not telling the story, because it is stocked up with temporary migrants. if you get below that and get a hold of the native population, you get a sense of how long -- far along the age structure is. and what changes have occurred. the gulf states are very

different because they bring in all of the labor. >> i think there is another factor that a lot of them are you put in the category up huge amounts of resources. they can basically buy off opposition. we know that is another trend, it is just not middle eastern but in other countries, too. angola is one where the regime's to have, and they also have look where you're whole economy depends on resource extraction and one way or another, which is

often tied up with the government. when you were talking earlier about this aging structure, and you have the beginnings of a commercial elite, and someone who was in depend it of estate i independenct of the state, think it is a much more difficult scenario to see four people. i think that is probably where your model does not work as well. >> we have about come to the end of the appointed hour. i think it is very much appreciated for you taking the time to walk us through a technical model in terms of it does not lend itself to the kind of political scientist. i did not take too much offense

to the beating up on us, but it takes some time to get through it. i think what we've seen today is even though it is a less familiar tool, political demography is a field that has not been as integrated into the kind of analysis that this town, washington and others are doing in a foreign policy context and security policy context that really bears paying attention to and suggests some different ways we can understand the challenges and the opportunit ies presented in this room. on april 1, we have had the opportunity to schedule people that have developed the notion of the demographic dividend and have scheduled them to come talk to us so we will continue the conversation in just a few days and hope that all of you will find these resources online here

at the wilson center web site and on our blog. hope you all contribute to that and find more discussion of this there. thank you so much for your insight. thank you everyone for your insight. please join me in thanking them. [applause]

>> at 3:45 p.m., we will take you to a roundtable discussion with a number of mayors in the country. there will talk about economic and budget pressures facing their cities. it is live here on c-span at 3:45 p.m. ahead of that, we will be in ottawa, canada for another session of the house of commons. the prime minister will be taking questions from the members of the house of commons today. it is likely that the budget introduced by the government earlier this week will dominate this session. tomorrow, expected th-- it is expected that the government will issue a vote of no-confidence. it will likely lead to the dissolution of parliament and triggered parliamentary elections in canada.

that will be live here in about 15 minutes or so on c-span. we will take you to ottawa for mr. de and part of yesterday's session -- ottawa for part of yesterday's session. yesterday's session. >> mr. speaker, spending thousands of dollars means that you have to short change the canadian family. there's nothing in this budget on affordable housing. there's nothing here on child care. there's nothing to support our health system. and these are the priorities of canadian families. why is this prime minister out

of touch and out of control? of touch and out of control? >> senior citizens are living in poverty. whether it is support for firefighters for doing and .i remitan extremely good job i am committed to public health care. he cut health care by $25 billion. [gavel] >> the hon. leader of the opposition. order. >> the priorities of this

government make no sense to canadians. they spent more in a single day at the g-20 than they spend on seniors in a year. they are about to spend 1000 times more on jets than helping students get a college or university education. no canadian can understand those priorities. why is this prime minister so out of touch? >> order. the hon. government house leader. >> we consulted seniors living in poverty. firefighters needed support and is in there. the liberal leader should put aside his own narrow part and do

the right thing for canadians and reduce his budget. >> the hon. leader of the opposition. we cannot support this budget, mr. speaker, because these priorities are bad for canadians. one dozen times more for prisons -- 1000 times more for prisons that for crime prevention parent nothing for affordable housing, nothing for child care, but billions more for prisons. for prisons. why is this prime minister so disconnected from the priorities of canadians? >> the liberal party cannot find billions of dollars for this fighter jets let's look at what canadians are saying about the budget. the canadian taxpayer

federation -- the canadian labour congress, this is a win for every senior. mr. speaker, environmental the fence, we applaud the the -- and of the -- environmental defense, we applaud them. >> mr. speaker, we have another problem with this government. they are investigating mr. carson, a former chief of staff of the prime minister, for the prime minister's closest advisers and may end up in prison for electoral fraud. he is just a breath away from being found in contempt of

government. when will they finally admit their responsibility for their abuse of power? >> we will not tolerate anyone breaking the law. breaking the law. we believe in those reforms. when these allegations were brought to our attention, we immediately inform the authorities. authorities. >> the conservative government is on the verge of being found in contempt of parliament. four of the closest collaborators of the prime

minister faced accusations of election fraud. after the contempt that this pattern reveals for canadians and for their institution, is it any wonder that this government will be rewarded with contempt in return? in return? >> the leader of the liberal party is showing contempt for canadian voters, mr. speaker. he does not accept the fundamental democratic principle that a person with a vote wins the status. now the coalition is back again, mr. speaker. that is utter contempt for canadians can what is right for canada is to get behind the tax plan to create jobs, more hope, and more opportunities. >> the hon. member -- >> the conservative government

tabled a budget is today that is indifferent to the needs of quebecers. this confirms what we have won four in -- what we have known for long time. does the prime minister realize that this budget, combined with many instances of contempt for parliament and democracy, confirms one thing? >> mr. speaker, my colleague, the minister of finance cannot table the budget yesterday that perfectly matches the aspirations and priorities of quebecers. economic recovery, job creation, mr. speaker, bail low level /acceptable level of taxation. nhk is, where we table a budget that -- in each case, where the budget, they are

against the. >> what he just said is false. after $3.7 billion, with a $3.3 billion and we supported it. this government is mocking the people and the house of commons. it spent millions of taxpayers' money in a pre-election campaign. it made sure to table in budget that would be an acceptable for the opposition party. and then the prime minister has the gall to repeat once again that he does not want elections. does he not realize that, by acting like this, he has lost the confidence of quebecers? >> the hon. minister of foreign affairs. >> mr. speaker, for the past 20 years, we have heard the same years, we have heard the same gnashing of teeth by this party .

what did they deliver for quebec and the last 30 years? nothing, zero. >> order, please. order. order. the hon. member. >> mr. speaker, we do not live on our knees. we live standing up. this conservative government could not care less about quebec. quebec. nothing prevented it from, the setting quebec -- prevented it from compensating quebec. does not the prime minister realize its indifference with quebec will provoke elections? quebecers will decide.

>> the hon. minister of finance. order. >> we have had good discussions with the government of quebec, the minister of finance of quebec, regarding the hse. we hope that we will have an agreement very soon and we will continue our talks with the quebec government. >> mr. speaker, they have been fooling around with this for 20 years. they continue to help wealthy. tax month -- tax cuts are maintained for oil companies. government continues to refuse to pay its consent to quebec. how can the prime minister say he can do justice for quebec but he can help his cronies in the oil companies? either he can or he is acting in

bad faith. >> mr. speaker, the mask will fall. this member parliament was part of the peking government. there are others in that group who were part of the peking government. never did they ask for this -- part of the pq government. there are others in that group who were part of pq government. never did they ask for this. >> order. >> mr. speaker, this government and every canadian knew where we stood. we wanted to make sure that this budget would be addressing the needs of middle class families and give them a break. in fact, too many people are out of work.

yesterday, the conservatives presented a job-killing budget that sucks far more out of the economy than it puts back him. they missed their own job target by more than two hundred 40,000 by more than two hundred 40,000 jobs -- two hundred 40,000 jobs according to their own figures -- 240,000 jobs according to their own figures. >> leader of the fourth party, if they had bothered to read the budget, he would know that 180,000 of seven created in this country. -- have been created in this country. this is the best place to invest in the next five years. they look at our financial system and said that this is not just the best financial system in the g-7 or the g-20.

it is the best financial system in the world. >> order. >> the minister knows he is not speaking the truth. he knowles -- he knows full well he is not telling the truth. >> the prime minister knows full well that part-time jobs are the record high. there are 150,000 full-time jobs fewer than before the recession. they do nothing to help the unemployed. but the banks and oil companies are still receiving big guests. why does the prime minister prefer to go into an election rather than help families and the middle class? >> the hon. minister of finance. >> once again, there is a tremendous benefit to reading the document.

the document. as i said yesterday, it is one of the shortest budgets that has happened in the last 20 years. there is a wonderful chart in there that shows job creation. 75% of those 480,000 jobs are full-time jobs. >> the hon. member for toronto danforth. order. >> they have not replaced the full-time work that has been lost in the rescission and the middle-class is suffering as a result. maybe better read his own document. now the government is refusing to invest in the best retirement plan, the canada pension plan. government wants to come with their own scheme so that he

street gets their own plan. >> the hon. minister of finance. >> again, he is demonstrating his uncanny ability to not let the facts interfere with his good argument could we have negotiations ongoing -- with his argument. we have negotiations ongoing. he has been in this place long enough. he ought to know that the federal government cannot unilaterally alter the canada pension plan. we shared jurisdiction with the provinces. there are rules. they are constitutional. you need two-thirds. we're continuing to work with the provinces. >> the hon. member.

>> on april 28, 2009, three months after burst person left the pmo, he had a meeting with the energy secretary. bruce person was there introduced as a special -- can he explain why his personal staff gets a special access month after he supposedly left the government's employ? >> mr. speaker, there have been serious allegations raised. we expect every single canadian to obey the law.

[unintelligible] >> that is some of the bait from yesterday in ottawa at the house of commons -- that is some of the debate from yesterday in ottawa at the house of commons. we have questioned time here in ottawa in the canadian house of commons today. it is expected that the canadian government will pass a no- confidence votes and will trigger parliamentary elections. >> well beyond high school, the dance skills for learning are absolutely important for canadian -- advanced skills for learning are absolutely important for canadian students.

their futures are at risk. in this western regions priories, why are they spending 1000 times more on stealth fighter warplanes that on students trying to get to school? 1000 times more, mr. speaker, why is that? >> the hon. government house leader. >> we want to make sure that the young men and women who serve an hour for some of the best equipment to keep us safe. serve in our air force have the best equipment to keep us said. >> both the pentagon and the parliamentary budget officer have demolished the

conservatives on fighter jets. the cost is $30 billion, 1000 times more than help for students. and for low-income seniors, these conservatives offer $1.15 per day. he compares it to depression relief in the third -- in the dirty 1930's. that is a dirty insult. why did this regime waste more money in one day on a lightness and g-20 binge last summer that they provided to low-income seniors for a whole year? >> the liberal party of canada wants to waste $4 million on eric this election. the real scandal here, mr. commissions that the yo will not accept the democratic will of canadians. they will love the open and transparent about it.

-- they will leave its open and trend -- they will not be open and transparent about it. >> the hon. member for montana. >> no one will take lessons for democracy from this crowd. the government has contempt for seniors, for families with sick or aging loved ones at home, contempt for parliament and taxpayers, falsifying documents, conservatives hauled into court on elections fraud, investigated for influence peltier. -- for influence allegations.

>> order. order. >> one of the most fundamental traditions in canada, one of the most fundamental parts of our liberal the odyssey is that the person with the most votes -- liberal democracy is that the person with the most votes wins, mr. speaker. they will form a coalition and for an unstable government. instead of spending $400 billion -- $4 billion in a new election, let's put that into low-income seniors. >> the dollar cost is talking about reminds me of a fiasco that this government is

responsible for. let's put this in perspective and say that the parliamentary budget officer and the pentagon can confirm our numbers. 1000 times more money for fighter jets then for our children's studies. 1,000 tons more money for prisons than crime-prevention. how can they look at themselves in the mirror? >> the prime minister -- the minister of national defence. >> the professional, non-artists and bureaucrats who work at the department of national defence disagree with the parliamentary budget officer. they said the methodology is wrong. you do not estimate the cost of a aircraft based on its weight. you do not wish and out in 30 years. d&b officials would be pleased to meet with the parliamentary budget officer to discuss is

methodology and discuss some of his flock findings. >> i sense the minister is transferring blame to be so world servants. if it is deplorable to sue -- blame to the civil servants. it is deplorable. they will be found guilty of contempt for parliament, for everything they have seen and done. this is the first in the world history of parliament. how can they even have such contempt for canadians? >> the liberal party is showing incredible contempt for canadians could they want to simply set aside the results of the last election campaign and

former director is an unstable coalition with their friends in the mvp. they refuse to be honest and transparent about it appeared instead of wasting $400 million -- about it. instead of wasting $400 million on elections, held up better in the lives of seniors? >> mr. speaker, when discussing the funding of the underwater electrical cable between newfoundland and nova scotia, the minister of defence stated that the interest of the atlantic provinces would go before those of quebec. then the prime minister tells his minister of defense that he could not care less of quebec's interests. his priority is canada, even if that is to the detriment of quebec.

>> mr. speaker, the leader would like to take this opportunity to congratulate the government for having reached an agreement with the quebec government on the fossil fuels that will create thousands of jobs in quebec for the coming years. >> order, please. the hon. member. >> the minister could have answered my question. what ottawa did they did with the atlantic provinces. quebec's conservative members are remaining silent. why did quebec not receive a single penny from the federal government to set in place its own hydroelectric plant?

it is financing quebec competition. that is unfair to quebec. >> conservative party members stand up. they will make sure, contrary to what the block is saying, but there will be no and fairness between quebec taxpayers and tax pairs from the ease, the west, or anywhere in the country. we will support the demands of quebec. the armorer -- in order to get a larger jet, newfoundland refuses to recognize an agreement on sharing the borders of the gulf of st. lawrence.

newfoundland says that, since the agreement was not enshrined by the federal berman, they're not bound by it. when it ratified the 1964 agreement so that quebec could have holsters tension over secretary rather than -- have whole control over its territory. they are ensuring that they will delay many projects and many agreements that are important to quebec. that was settled by my colleagues, the minister for financial resources and the government of quebec. this is intangible evidence of

the concrete success of our government. >> quebec imposed a moratorium until 2012 for the exploration and operation of fossil fuels in the st. lawrence so that we can wait for the environmental assessments. given the cautionary principle, will the government ask newfoundland to hold a moratorium on this explanation in the said lawrence so that's serious environmentalism can take place? >> we know full well that the garment of quebec decides to impose a moratorium for the next two years with regard to the hydrocarbon findings in the gulf of st. louis -- st. lawrence. they do not seem to know about

decisions between the government and the quebec government. >> affordable, practical, reasonable solutions to take the pressure of family budgets. brechtel solution that would have given middle-class families a break still struggling to come out of this recession, straining cpp. why has this prime minister refuse to show leadership by working together? why is he rejecting getting results and instead choosing to provoke an election? >> the hon. government house leader. >> we have been no budget designed to provide jobs and economic opportunities and support to the rest of all hon. seniors.

and to the men and women who helped build this country and the little bit of extra help. why will not they ever stand up and support good measures that help healthcare and the canadian seniors who are vulnerable? why will they not do the right thing and support a good budget? >> mr. speaker, we're always prepared to work with others to obtain results. the prime mr. knows that. i worked with him -- the prime minister knows that. i worked with him and the opposition. we signed many letters together. since he became prime minister, it is more difficult, but we did manage to obtain $1 million for the unemployed a year ago or more. as well as apologies for the residential schools. we have demonstrated that we can work together. why does the prime minister

refuse to work with others? >> consultation with canadians -- we did a lot of listening, the minister of finance and the members of parliament across the country. a package focused on jobs and opportunity, helping the muscle level seniors, to increasing support for their income supplements. the real concern that the have --n tu >> the democrats understand that

getting the job done is number one. the democrats negotiated a budget amendment for $4.6 ties.on for canadian priorie >> mr. speaker, if we wanted to take advice on how to run a federal government, we would not take it from him. i spent -- less than four months, he voted to get the liberal government that a power. if the liberals want to work

with them to force a coalition government, that is not in their interests. that is one for canada. >> mr. speaker, bill is the conservative plan that will impose drinking water systems. mr. speaker, bruce carson was responsible for our original policy and is legislative director and helped to develop x11. >> that is absolutely outrageous.

they are showing absolute contempt for canadian voters in normally, in canada, the winner of the election gets to form a government. they want to form a risky and stable government. they do not have the courage to be open and transparent with canadians. rather than spend $400 million on an unnecessary election, let's put that money to work for canadian seniors. >> the hon. member from winnipeg. >> this is about the prime minister's judgment. how does a man like this give put in charge of drafting government legislation? how does this barbwire who served till time and is being chased by revenue canada get the highest security clearance? why do these ministers meet with waswhen a new bursbruce carson banned from lobbying.

now we know that his son was the senior ministerial adviser to jim santos. did he have any role a ? >> order. >> more fear from the liberal party. nothing shows a tax plan that helps create jobs and will support the most vulnerable seniors from everything, the guaranteed income supplement. all we have is a liberal party with contempt for the canadian electorate. they want to force a unnecessary election rather than worry about seniors. >> bill s11 would give the

people the power to impose their solutions for the drinking water of the first nation. telling them they are not confident enough to decide for themselves is already quite insulting. under this scheme, his fiancee would have pocketed $80 million in commissions on the sale of water filtration systems. are they not ashamed of profiting with the unfortunate situation? >> single dollar, not a single dollar. the reality is that the speaker of the liberal party is making it up as a goal long -- as they go along. the person with the most votes

wins. the liberals should stop their contempt for the canadian electorate. >> >> in the paths are awful as they stand. mr. speaker, the leader of the prime minister's office, the special adviser to environment minister, the special adviser to the last two ministers natural resources, and the current lieutenant -- this is a regular one-man band. they drafted a deal that would allow him to get his chance on money allocated for something else. and the prime minister did not know what was going on? how can canadians believe him? >> the prime minister said the following -- if they attack one

of them, that means they do not have a single political argument left. [unintelligible] >> order, please. the hon. member. order. >> the hypocrisy of the conservatives is limitless. the prime minister and the minister of finance knew very well the legitimate demands, notably the $2.2 million compensation. it was a risk to provoked an election. will the minister of finance admit to his lack of -- to lead

to the possible elections? no, mr. speaker. >> we have negotiations going with quebec. they are going well. they want an election so we will have a delay. >> mr. speaker, to have a train derailed is nothing better than this. if they did not want an election, the conservatives would not have launched a pre- election campaign. if they did not want a campaign, the minister of finance would abandon his infamous predatory project for a single securities commission. will the prime minister admit that this election will be his

responsibility, his and his government? >> we presented the bright and budget for canada, for all of canada. it is a plan praise across canada, from coast to coast, a plan that has the credibility of top economists, a plan that keeps taxes low. it helps low-income seniors, families, small business, caregivers, manufacturers, workers, and much more. that is what canadians want, not an election caused by a power-seeking coalition. >> of the hon. member. order. >> mr. speaker, the conservatives denied the challenges that over half the population is facing. there's nothing in the budget to

improve the lives of women. in the last two years, the conservatives cut funding to women's rights groups and allowed a fundamental right to be negotiated. does the prime minister realize that is -- that is his government that is indifferent to the needs of the women of quebec and could provoke an election? >> the hon. minister public works. >> that is absolutely false. this government has raised in the budget for the status of women to the highest level in the history of the department. i ask the member to work with us to improve the lives of women from coast to coast. >> the hon. member. but the fed government is continuing to refuse to uphold its responsibility. the conservative budget

contends no new monies for affordable social housing. according to figures provided, quebec is being provided a $57 million per year for the construction of social housing units and $78 million set to renovate existing low rent housing units. does a promise to realize that it is his government's indifference to the needs of the senate -- of the in it -- the inadequate housing. >> mr. speaker, it is our government that has invested $2 billion in affordable housing. there is a lot more in our economic plan. there were 12 dozen projects in canada -- there were 12,000

projects in canada. they voted against this like they will vote against a budget that will be tabled this week that would help canadians. they would prefer that a coalition that does not respect the wishes of canadians. >> mr. speaker, bruce carson was given privileged access by the prime tester to inside information about canada's energy and environment policies. it was not alone. the conservative pay $15 million for a new program while mr. carson was advising the prime minister on energy and environment and made him the executive director of the same program. but the deputy director is a former conservative policy adviser to the minister of industry which decided to fund the program in the first place. to top that off, he is a former vice president of the conservative party. the question is no longer whether the prime minister is giving --

>> the hon. member. order. >> mr. speaker, i did not hear a questionnaire. >> mr. speaker, we know why the member opposite is avoiding the question. this prime minister gave 50 million taxpayer dollars to employees and former senior staff been on the organization's web site concerning the energy and environment, there is a presentation mr. carson gave. the title "managing a conservative political agenda in a minority situation." the give advice on how to manipulate the media and members of parliament. >> the it schauble government house leader. -- the hon. government house

leader. >> i do not think i heard a question there. i remember when peggy nashua's year. she was always fighting for the cause of senior citizens. if she were in this house today, she would be voting for the guaranteed income supplement. it is in the best interest of canadians and they deserve it. >> the hon. member. >> mr. speaker, bruce carson is now the subject of an investigation. it is said that the minister of natural resources gave him a mandate. what mandate to did carson have for quebec as and his duties? -- for quebeckers and his duties? >> it is a level-led coalition want to falsify the results of the next election campaign.

worse yet, they will not be open and transparent about their attempt to push aside the results of the next election campaign. canadians deserve better and our seniors need help from the income supplement. but that money to work for canadian seniors. >> the hon. member. >> mr. speaker, at the ball like that, they will have to find a job insert the sla -- in cirque de soleil. money was given to a man who defrauded clients. this is a white collar criminal. they got a mandate to directly from the government.

it starts to sound like the cover. why are there so many privileges for this individual? >> this from a man who sat around the table -- it is just a little rich. >> the hon. member. >> our government is focused on the priorities of canadians. the economic action plan was issued in this house. i'm fortunate, the coalition led by the liberal leaders have said that they will force an opportunistic election. can the prime minister of this house on the budget to improve the welfare of canadians? i would like to thank my colleague for that great question. i am proud of our government budget measures for doctors as well as students.

our budget also includes family caregiver assistance. mr. speaker, unfortunately, the reckless coalition has said they will force an unnecessary and costly election that will kill the measures that will help canadians. hong >> another day, another investigation into conservative corruption. one is getting to years of french training and full salary before he begins work. they have appointed -- now there is more evidence of patronage

well above. what happened to their promise to clean up liberal-style corruption? >> our government is committed to accountability and transparency. the minister's office does not in fear fear in the hiring practices of the agency. -- does not interfere in the hiring practices of the agency. we know that coalition members would raise taxes and kill jobs, not only in ottawa, canada, but across this country. >> any pretense of reform under the accountability act is giving way to the number of patronage and rauf bottle politics. there is a group of roe sliding

their own pockets. trying to profiteer from the third world conditions go beyond unethical. it is reprehensible. i want them to tell us one thing. what role does bruce carson play in the federal accountability act? >> the hon. member for san h bruno. >> the budget contains no direct assistance to improve and come, no inclination to restore assistance for respiratory artists. does the minister realize that

it is his government that could provoke an election? >> the hon. minister of canadian heritage. >> mr. speaker, as usual, this is completely and truly a fixed budget. we have fixed budget for arts and culture. they support our budget. a group said that the 2011 budget shows the government art ands to promote culture. it was said that the budget is good and they have presentations in the french language.

>> for years, people have been asking for an increase in transfers. instead of continuing to interfere in quebec jurisdiction with new research, it was announced in the government that could provoke an election. >> the hon. minister of human resources. >> mr. speaker, they are ignoring the facts. the fact is that we have introduced canada grants to help students, to give the money for tuition, to go to post-secondary education. and not have this much debt.

it is because we have -- and not have as much debt. it is because we want to help them. the bloc voted against all of our efforts as they will vote again. >> the list of politically motivated conservative appointments was said earlier the house. but none is more concerned or egregious than those taking place in and up, -- in acoa. can the prime minister confirm how many appointees are being investigated? >> the hon. minister of national revenue. >> mr. speaker, again, i will reiterate my previous comments. we do not interfere in the hiring practices.

the federal accountability act tightened up their roles and provides guidelines which are always adhered to. >> the hon. member. >> he can tell that to the judge. we should spend more time looking after atlantic canadians. maybe we would not have been shafted in the budget like we did this week. $85 million for fisheries emotion and $35 million for marine atlantic. -- where were these ministers when the robbery was going on?

>> he knows he cannot refer to members of the house by their names. but the prime minister of national -- but the minister of national revenue -- >> i would ask him to give us -- we have a responsibility to review the programs and practices. we're delivering the best results for canadians. any responsible organization does that. the real concern is now that we know that coalitions across the way would recklessly increased spending, raise taxes, and affect atlantic canada as well as all of canada. >> the hon. member. >> no. families are struggling

to find doctors and nurses. this budget does nothing to solve that problem. the dean of the school of medicine said, "providing financial incentives are not enough to turn on the shortage of doctors and nurses in rural northern canada. why did the conservatives -- the plan to increase the number of family doctors and nurses in the conservatives reject the plan to increase the number of family doctors and nurses in rural northern canada? >> the vote against the budget is rejection of the research money that we're putting forward appeared in this -- putting forward. a vote against the budget is voting against doctors and

nurses. >> mr. speaker, they hated hsg. they claim that they will somehow addressed -- levels of party. every time a ceo has a handout, he gets millions of dollars in tax cuts. but what about the seniors in this country? they deserve better. why does not this government give all the canadians the retirement dignity that they deserve? >> my hon. friend reflection of british columbia is really a

matter of fact. because of british columbia, the level of government and is advocating ghg. [unintelligible] we have indeed brought in significant increases to low- income seniors to meet their needs. >> the hon. member. >> mr. speaker, i few moments ago, my colleague, the minister for natural resources, arrived in the house. typically, mr. speaker, he is extremely punctual, always on time. in fact, was he delayed and it was for an excellent reason? i would let him tell the house

that very good reason, the hon. minister of natural resources. a historicannounced m agreement. the quebec government has been asking for this agreement for many years. it was our government that delivered the goods. >> we have done so, despite members that were opposed. mr. speaker, the choices now clear. they have the choice. the hon. member. order.

mr. speaker, it is a raid disgraceful enough that the conservatives are giving their jobs to bodies -- to their bodies across canada. in an effort to put things right, they will pay off to two years' salary, just so they can learn french. do the conservatives take at a glance it canadians for false? -- take canadians for fools? >> when we talk about the good character of great atlantic canadians, especially those who have provided a service to atlantic canada for many years. life-long public servants. if a member has a question about that, perhaps he should ask his colleague about the character of the individual we are talking about. >> the hon. member for quebec, mr. speaker. >> it is normal for governments

to be solvent, but by requiring this to be completed 50 days before the deadline, a requirement that had not. clement -- preliminary documents, the conservatives are denying that there is a demand that the federal government give a fair chance for a submit -- if this is a myth for proposal. the hon. minister, the clerk. >> mr. speaker, i am glad the hon. member knows it is important for a company to be solvent. the national building strategy has been in full consultation. and course -- importantly, it was over same in terms of the financial requirements, and an independent status monitor says objectively, free from personal

favoritism, and encompassed the elements of openness and competitiveness. that, is what i think is important. >> mr. speaker, elected members of parliament, including 26 conservatives voted to stabilize the medicines for all bill. we have obtained an e-mail drafted by the industry minister directing conservative senators to kill the bill. it is a relic of the 19th century, according to the prime minister, to kill a bill this house passed. they are putting profits for the big drug companies against saving lives. did the conservatives understand democracy, or do they just not like it? >> [laughter] [applause] >> mr. speaker, the fact of the matter is that dell as drafted

will not do anything to help. that is what the hon. member knows. if he really wants this bill to pass in the senate, he should be voting for the budget, apartment to continue, then the bill will be debated in the senate. [unintelligible] a of that ridiculous arguments to resolve the government, they .ould form a coalition ca [applause] >> a few short weeks ago, our conservative government once again demonstrated we will stand up for victory. this house passed the shameful practice of releasing after a mere one sixth of their salaries. they said it would be better for

inmate morale. [unintelligible] >> the hon. minister of public safety. >> i would like to thank the member for her hard work on this file. i am pleased to inform the house that yesterday, abolishing the accelerated proper role received royal assent, however the news is not all good, mr. speaker. talking to each and every liberal senators stood in their place and voted to put car thieves, drug dealers and white collar criminals back on the streets early, but do not expect the liberal member to help peddle, we sure can count on senator larry smith. >> the hon. member for ottawa south. >> i would like suggested

question. mr. speaker, i would like to know what the government proposes for businesses -- >> we will leave here momentarily as question time wraps up. tomorrow, it is expected the canadian parliament will pass a motion of no-confidence in the government of prime minister stephen harper, and the leader of the conservative party, which will lead to a parliamentary election in canada, likely to be said in early may. in about 40 minutes or so, a roundtable discussion with the number of mayors from around the country talking about economic development and budget pressures faced in their -- facing their cities. it will be live here, on c-span. >> tonight, a look at education reform with former washington, d.c., school chancellor michele re-, and sacramento mayor and former nba player kevin johnson.

they will discuss why they think student achievement has worsened, despite a doubling of federal spending over the last 30 years. >> it is all of us doing our part, whether you have kids or not. there are far too many kids that are languishing in schools that are not doing well, but there are also kids living in nice neighborhoods, and their schools are not serving them to the degree they need to as well. >> i concur with him. we are in a position right now in this country where if you were to tell me the zip code that a child lives in, and the race of that child, if we could with pretty good accuracy tell you what their academic achievement levels are. that is one of the most of american things that i could possibly imagine. his be trained the ideals by which we live. >> was event from the university of arkansas tonight at 8:00 p.m.

eastern on c-span. >> fox news national security analyst katie mcfarland and a former defense officials talk about global hotspots. this is part of the leadership program of the rockies annual retreat in colorado springs. the for speeches an hour. an hour less gathering, one we're about to go into our speak out session, i said we would pause for a minute because i wanted to show you somebody who typifies everything we tried to practice here.

if we put on the world-famous youtube video, and i said we're not the fund if he could come to the retreat? daniel hannan is a writer and a journalist, and has been a conservative member of the european parliament since 1999, when in reelection in 2004 and 2009. in the european parliament he led the campaign for a referendum, writing in detail about the allowances and expenses available in brussels. in march of 2009, a youtube clip of his speech to gordon brown attracted 1.4 million hits within the first 72 hours, making it by far the most watched political clip in british history. he is the author of nine books, of which the most recent "a new road to serfdom, a letter of warning to america" -- here it

is right here. it is a best seller. blogs every day on political and cultural issues, attracting two hundred thousand hits a week from 80,000 unique users. we are fortunate to have him with us today. please welcome member of european parliament, daniel hannan. [applause] >> well, bob, thank you very much for those generous words, and lays and gentlemen, thank you for the welcome. it is not something we are accustomed to as members of the european parliament. we are generally not the most popular people. do not feel that you have to contradict me when i say that. i have gotten used to it. maybe it has something to do with the fact that none of you could vote for me.

this is an huawei match, if you would like. he will not find a politician in the united kingdom who is a bigger fan of jeffersonian democracy than me, but i suspect that even your third president occasionally enjoy being able to speak to an audience where nobody could vote for him, and he did not need to worry about what he said. we had an election a couple of months ago, a general election, and there is nothing like people casting their votes to remind and all elected representative of the full diversity of wildlife with whom he represents within his constituency. [laughter] >> your chairman knows what i'm talking about, but he is too polite. this is a home match for him. i can see one or two state legislatures thinking the same thing. do you know about cattle in colorado? i spoke to a cattle farmer who

was delighted to come across as a member of the european parliament. he told me a long story. he spent a great deal of money on a pedigree bowl, which apparently would not do the business. it would not serve any of them. on the internet, he discovered this wonderful drug, and he inserted into the seat, and double could not get enough of it. -- the bold could not get enough of it. he was alarmed that the european parliament would banned substance. i said what is the drug called. he said he could not remember what it was called, but it tastes of aniseed. [laughter] >> this is a -- [laughter] >> this is an extraordinary country. when i was researching this book, i cannot resist giving another plug.

i will be available to sign that in the main hall. when i was doing primary research, i found myself last year addressing the republican committee of a rural county in the deep south. at the committee members looked pretty much the way i would expect them to look in the deep south. they were rugged, sunburned, and muscular. one asked a question -- you were losing for a long time, now you're winning, what advice to you head for the gop? i said one of the mistakes of looking from outside seems to be that under the bush presidency you turn your back on state rights and liberalism. he ran up huge deficits, spending a lot of money in washington, striking down

state's rights on issues from houston nation -- euthanasia and same-sex unions. i thought maybe that was not the right example to give to a republican committee of the rural county in the deep south. sure enough, when i finished, at enormous man with a red baseball cap and a great belly came up to me, and he said "son, i appreciate you common -- you coming." [applause] [laughter] >> i apologize to seveners. he said "i agree with most of what you said, but i must disagree with what you said about homosexual unions. my experience, and not in under any pressure been married is one of the things i enjoy as a gay

man. i thought, truly this is an astonishing country. every time you think you have understood it, it surprises you. the sheer diversity, the pluralism, the variety is what makes anti-americanism a perverse doctrine. it is truly misanthropy. [laughter] [applause] >> let me say again what a huge pleasure it is to be in colorado. i am struck by how levelheaded of people are in this state. let me say i have not met a completely representative cross- section of colorado. i have been here three times. the first time was in denver,

the second time was to the coke foundation, and the third time is now. maybe i have not met a cross- section of colorado society, but nonetheless i believe there is something very attractive about the state, and it is this -- is an encapsulation, a boiling down, said an exaggeration, if you would, of all the things that made america special. americans came on a long way to find a particular lifestyle to find freedom. some of them went even free it -- further, us to look for more liberty. those were the ones who came to the frontier. they then the design their state constitutions are around the maximum dispersal of power. one of the things that i find most excited about these geometric states is how they have so much influence on procedures, a balanced budget amendments, term limits, and so far -- so on. this is an exaggeration of the

american policy. i do not think it was a coincidence -- this was the last redoubt of freedom. it called on in colorado, when it was defeated everywhere else. [applause] >> i wanted to say a little word about the political inheritance. when i was writing this book, i've traveled around a number of states. i spoke to senators, congressmen, people on the left and the right, a journalist, think tanks, and ordinary citizens. if the same conclusion kept leaping out at me -- most americans do not realize how lucky they are. the political institutions that defined this country are, in many cases, unique, and in almost all cases, unusual. i'm talking about the term limit. if the recall mechanism.

the referendum and valid procedures. i'm talking about state rights and localism. i'm talking about open primaries. a unique feature that makes legislature's annual budget accessible to the rest of us. i'm talking about the direct election of almost everybody from the sheriff to the school board. it is human nature to take for granted that witch's familiar to us, but it is these institutions growing organically out of the constitution that have served to keep your government small, and your people free. sometimes i say this, and american friends say there are cultural differences. we are naturally a liberal people. we got away from the monarchies of the old world. i'm afraid that explanation does not quite work. culture is not some distant bodies, numinous entity that exists along institutions. culture is a product of

institutions. if you changed your governing arrangements, and if you had the same welfare state, the same big government, the same roles for uncollected state mechanisms and other parts of the western world, you would see very quickly how those other aspects of american exception was and would disappear. the essence of this country is freedom. was freedom that first hold the pilgrims -- freedom in the literal sense of wanting to be able to organize and worship as they saw fit without state intervention. allied with that was the idea of self-government. free from an aristocracy. evolves institutions, based on self-governance, around the massive and the evolution of power. when your framers came to draw up the constitution, they were not working from an abstract

blueprint. there were encoding and enshrining liberties that were very real to americans of that era. what happened in philadelphia remains one of the miracles of political development. your constitution has a land bridge it lasted for as long as it has because it did the -- has lasted as long as it has because it did what it's authors intended. no one is above the law. decisions are taken as closely as possible to the people that they effected. now, some of you might be wondering why it is that i come here as a patriotic british, who loves his country very dearly, and sings the praises of a republic that was born out of a revolt against the british crown?

is it not a curious thing that i am praising your constitution, after all the u.s. was a reaction to the british empire. did paul revere not reviled a nation with his cries of "the british are coming?" he did not. actually. he shouted the regulars are out. it would have been unusual. it would have been a very, very strange thing. it would not have gone on americans of that era that great britain was a foreign country, but the way in which the story of paul revere has been written by historians on both sides of the atlantic is a very telling one. it depends on editing, disregarding a lot of the arguments which your country's

leaders were using at the time. they never saw themselves as revolutionaries. they saw themselves as conservatives. all that they were asking for in their own minds was the freedoms that they assumed they had been born with as englishmen. the real revolutionaries to them were those in the an invariant court who were seeking to unbalance the constitution, to impose laws that have not been properly passed. that is why, if you go back to their foundational documents, the main complaint in the declaration of independence was precisely that the crown was using foreign soldiers. there was a love realign the jefferson wanted to write into the declaration where jefferson said "we might have been a graceful and free people together." i might come up with this and say maybe we still will.

this is more than academic or historical interest. if your government turned its back on the origins of your freedom, if your rulers lack the humility to understand that they are parsing through institutions that are bigger than they are, you jeopardize all of the benefits that came from that extraordinary and political settlement. i was reading on the playing over, "our freedoms were won by our ancestors on battlefields in england. there is a straight line from riding need to philadelphia." the site went not marked until the 1950's. there was no memorial until a memorial was raised there by the american bar association.

it remains the only monument at the site. if you have leaders who are fundamentally, to put it as neutrally as possible, in paris, if not actively high style to this -- embarrassed, if not actively hostile to this, who do not see themselves as heirs to a continuing condition, who did not understand that there is simply one more link in a chain that stretches back to the glorious revolution, even to the fulcrum of anglo-saxon freedom, the notion that law comes from the people, then you are bound to have a change in the balance of power within the united states. that is more or less what is happening. if some are making this argument

in the 1930's, arguing against the new deal and the roosevelt administration. he saw, correctly, that the outcome of those constitutional changes would be a permanent shift in power in favor of the executive. how at flea those same arguments apply today, one we have seen in the last couple of years the shift in jurisdiction from legislature, to executive, to the 50 states, from washington, to the elected representative, from the citizen, to the state. your current administration's policies are not a set of random initiatives lashed arbitrarily together. they amount to a comprehensive program of european is asian. -- europeanization. whether or not i put any credence on the idea of your

president not been born in the u.s., and could have been born in kenya, i say no, he was plainly born in brussels. [laughter] >> if you look at the policies he is pursuing on health care, college education, green tax, on foreign policy, they are eight patents, a comprehensive policy of taking a country that is different from western europe and making it more like everywhere else. it is exactly the point that charles krogh hammer was making less night. i have been a member of the european parliament for 11 years, i am living in your future, and take it from me, you are not going to like it. when you make these permanent shift in power away from the people and toward federal bureaucracies. there are as ours, for heaven's sake.

-- czars for heaven's sake. you will find you make your less free. it will fall further and further behind. let me quote case carries statistic. -- a scary statistic. in 1974, western europe accounted for 36% of world's gdp. today, that figure is 24%, and in 2020, it will be 15%. over the same time, the share of the world's gdp accounted for by the u.s. has remained steady. what does that tell you? it tells me that if you go down this road toward nationalization, and bailouts, toward more rights for all the trade unions, toward a regulation of private sector remuneration, you will eventually make your economy smaller in relative terms. it is short in the long -- in

the -- is nice in the short term. what is not like -- where does not to like? but, in the end, reality imposes itself, and you find your economy contracts, or you are sustaining that only through debt. it is at this stage, my friend, that your problems, our new problem. when i see you setting out on the road which europe on wisely set out on after the second world war toward higher taxes, toward more regulation, i do not just feel for you as fellow english-speaking allies, i also worry, as a citizen of the world, about what this will to to the balance of power in the world that my children are going to grow what into. we are living at the end of a

300 or 400 year and will sphere ascendancy. the world has been a brighter and better place because of the english-speaking people. we have great achievements to our name, achievements we should not be ashamed to pass on to our children, from the ending of slavery, to the liberation of tens of millions from fascism and communism. there is nothing god-given about entitlement to that position. the laws of gravity will not be suspended in our favor if we pursue policies that make our nation's more pork and more week. since the credit crunch hit, it has been popular to " jonathan swift. he wrote "a baited banker from

his own hands foresees his fall ." it is like the writing on the wall. who has your bonds now? who owns american debt now? i think of the answer to that, and i tremble. let me quote some figures from the congressional budget office, 2010 long-term budget a lot. by 2020, your government will be paying between 15% and 20% of its revenue in debt interest, whereas defense spending will be down between 14 and 16%. what does that mean in reality? last year, the u.s. spent $665 billion on its military. the chinese spent around 99 billion. if beijing continues to buy american debt the present rate, five years from now the interest

payments on your debt to china will be covering the whole of the chinese defense budget, should they choose to reach out and conquered taiwan, you, my friends, will have paid for it. now, all right, there is nothing you should do, and nothing you should want to do about the economic rise of countries in asia if they have finally discovered our western secret. good for them. the bigger their market, the better for our exporters, but there is something we can do about our own decline. there is no reason for us to carry on the policies of the endless consumption without matching production. there is no reason for us to carry on in getting our children. i think we, as people, understand this instinctively, he even if our leaders seem not to.

i was amazed, just after the credit crunch hit two years ago, by how quickly an intellectual and political consensus formed around the idea of this massive state intervention, the and bailouts, the stimulus package. it happened during the conservative party conference. i was the only elected british politician at that time who was opposed to the bailout. there are loads of them now say it did not work. it was one of those scary moments that it seemed almost unpatriotic to say we should not be rushing to do things. i remember having an argument with a senior member of my party who said you are completely on your own with this. he said maybe not in your own, you and ron paul, and that is it. [laughter] >> two weeks later, the first opinion poll came out, and i was able to send this senior member

any the less said it turned out to be me, ron paul, and 86% of the british electorate. [laughter] [applause] >> most people do not need convincing of the argument that governments, just like individuals, have to live within their means. we all know that if you are maxed out on your credit cards, hugh rein in your spending. you have to be an economist for a politician not to understand that. most people understand that it is wrong for taxpayers to be pressed into bailing out wealthy individuals in order to rescue them from the consequences of their own areas. we do not need to win the battle of ideas. if anything has tilted the argument in favor of us, it is the events of the last two years, but we do need to win the battle of the implementation. here is the paradox of our age. we understand, and anyone new to

the argument will understand how. disasters it is to keep spending money when you are not making it. -- understand how disastrous it is to keep spending money when you are not making it. that is the challenge for you, my friends. that is what i hope you'll come out of the summit and make the case for. you still have a representative democracy. if you still have mechanisms to make your legislature's accountable. your primaries and the tea party movement formed to make use of that has begun the process of creating a legislature dedicated to fiscal sanity, but that is not an argument that u.n. once. that is a constant, continuing debate, and wants to take your foot off of the excel a writer, you will see that government will continue to expand again. make no mistake about what is at stake. it is not just prosperity. it is about the kind of world

that we have taken for granted. a world in which there is freedom, where government is constrained, and where we expect lost to the past and taxes to be levied only with popular consent. the world has been fortunate in its superpower. things could look very black with an alternative power. let me close with a heartfelt imprecation from a british conservative losses country to american conservatives who still believe in there's -- in there's -- keep intact the sublime and harridans from your parents, -- inheritance from your parents, and pass it on, securely, to your children. under your founders, respect the greatest constitution designed by human intelligence, and never be afraid to speak to and for the soul of this nation of

which my good fortune and god's grace your privilege to be part of. [laughter] [applause] >> will bounce back to the two microphones. [applause] >> all right. time for questions. we will use the two microphones. state turning, where each region where you are from, and we will alternate. >> i will start with the lady here. >> linda chapman, what is your government thinking about or are doing about the possible increase in population in the islamic culture in thinking

about the future of islam taking over and electing people to your government? >> well, we already have a number of elected muslim councilmembers, and their opinions are very different from those of the of the ticks you hear on television, because you would not get elected in the united kingdom of standing on a platform that we should be more like a run. there was a people why these people most. -- moved. we do have a specific problem with british-more the boys who becomes so alienated that in extreme cases, they have been driven to take up arms against the country. . we have rounded up dozens of british-born moslem. we had two boys that went to guess s suicide bombers.

people ask what it is that could have allocated -- alienated the kids have grown up in britain with all of their cares looked after carrot what could push them into this position -- looked after? and what could push them into this position? it is precisely their dealings with the state's the desktop and to despise the country. if they had any history, it would have been presented to them as a hateful chronicle of racism and exploitation. when they find the patriotism of their indigenous culture and scorned, and when they see the lead of their country are gwynedd the nation state is finished, that we should all be european, that the united kingdom is indescribable concept, how does that help them fit in? it is perhaps no coincidence to see business as a brand scorned

this way, that some have started breaking backwards. where does that leave the child of the immigrants? what is there for him to be part of? this is the point that the prime minister made in his speech three weeks ago in munich. the problem has not been with immigrants coming and demanding that we change things. the problem has been with those inside our governments who have a vested interest in differences. they are the people whose jobs would disappear if assimilation became a reality. as upton sinclair once wrote, it is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his job depends upon not understanding. [applause] [laughter]

>> this might come as a surprise to some of you, and i know it is not what you hear these kinds of meetings, but i have not had a single muslim constituent that as the other then approving of what david cameron said. it seems obvious that the state should not be giving money. that is a statement of the pretty bloody obvious. the extraordinary thing is that anyone found it shocking. the extraordinary thing is we got to the stage where the british prime minister had to say it was a bad idea to use taxpayer money to foster division. i think there is a lesson for you. one of the things your country has been very, very good at historically is making people feel part of a common dream and a combination. typically, a warm and optimistic phrase that ronald reagan used

when he said every immigrant makes america a more american. what a great idea. what a wonderful way of encouraging people to settle in. you go around the world apologizing for everything, if you turn your back on the things that made this country strong, great, and free, and drove your father's to extend that vision of freedom to other continents, you make it much harder for newcomers to assimilate. we have caught on almost too late to that message. do not repeat our mistakes. yes, please. >> dave, i am the class of 2010. how many do we have out there? [applause] >> ok. my question is straightforward. i lived in holland for six years. i have had socialized medical care. i have lived under socialist governments and systems. it is very clear to me that it is not the best system.

no system is perfect. i would like to ask you whether we could do to inform people in the united states that keep hearing over and over the the british medical system is better than here, said the canadian system is better than here, that the cuban system is better than here, and the people seem to soak it up here car and we believe what we read. i have to look at people, and say i lived in that, i know what it is like, and it is not superior. i hate to see us moving in that direction. any practical unless you could give us would be appreciated. >> i will tell you that once you have done this thing you will find it impossible to go back. it will take over the political system. it becomes almost beyond criticizing. if you're planning to repeal this obama-care, my friends, you do it right now. the idea of whether you can see

if it works out, and then come back, that is not how it works. which is a better system? in every system you have good outcomes and bad outcomes. in every system, you have good people and bad people. no system is perfect. people talk only from their personal experience. my life was saved by this system. if you look at the measurable data, the empirical evidence -- survival rates, waiting times, longevity, you could make a comparison, and see that our system, the british system which is based on a government monopoly is not the worst in the industrialized world, but it is pretty bad. we are, on most measures, behind some countries that are not nearly as wealthy as we are. how likely your service -- to survive a heart attack or cancer

-- on those things we do badly, and the current government is taking steps to try and make the system of little bit more responsive. here is the sink. it is almost impossible to make that argument. any criticism of the system is how will the down as this -- and attack on the people that work in it. to say what i have said is to invite a response from the left and health-care you insane you are attacking our hard-working health-care workers and unions. of course, i'm not doing that. we have many decent people that are doing their best and a system that does not maximize their potential i am not even attacking the lazy ones. all i'm saying is we could do better. in terms of innovation, in terms of outcome, you are on your way if you carry-on down this road toward a system you will not be

happy with. once politicians become personally responsible for every body lying on a hospital bed, you will not be able to reform it. there will be no going back. >> good morning. john andrews, centennial institute. we hear all about the fiscal crisis of greece, ireland, and the other countries around the periphery of the european union. from your standpoint, as parliamentarians, how much is that going to effect the continuation of them he project, the euro as a common currency, and the appetite of the british people to further integrate with your? >> if there is no appetite, us to take the last bit. the only appetite for closer integration comes from a handful of politicians and big corporations. no ordinary person supports it. my main campaign in britain is to get as a referendum, because

there is such a mismatch between public opinion and political opinion. two-thirds of the people, according to the last though, wants to leave the european union. that position is shared by less than 2% of european parliament, which is what happens when you do not have primaries. it is obvious what should happen. what this crisis has proved is that you cannot apply a single monetary policy to y delete- divergent economies -- widely divergent economies. it is exactly what those of us who oppose the euro predicted what happened, and it has come to pass. what should happen is we should allow the poor real countries to leave the monetary union, to print their own currencies again, to sue their monetary policy to their own interests and needs. unfortunately, that is not what

is happening. did default assumption is that the answer is more europe. more year.g well, it europe doing bad, more your apparent -- more europe. there is a great logical floor. all they're saying is european intervention has failed, so let's have more of it. because monetary union has been a disaster, but said fiscal and economic unity as well. they are mimicking what was said from the beginning. we always said this could only work if they took away the national democracy and had a single system of government. it is argued that hew to control the currency controls the country. that is the only time i " cannes approvingly. never mind him. but me give you a a much better

source. i will refer you to the gospel of matthew. the lord is asked whether it is proper to pay taxes to rome. he said show me the tribute money. jesus said unto him, who is in this image, and to prescription, they answered him caesars and many said unto caesar, the things that are caesar's, and on to god, the things that are god. before you conclude that i have lost my mind, i am not arguing that our lord is on one side or the other about the euro. [laughter] the point of the story is when he was looking to identify the supreme source of temporal power, the one absolute symbol of government control, he pointed to the coin. economic policy is not a side issue that ministers get around to in their spare time. it is a central business of the

modern states. if that power passes from the 27 nations of europe to the institutions of the eu and the collected eurocrats that run it, we have given away our democracy. >> i live for two years in the u.k., and i can attest to the respect any fees are given. there was a sense that the american experiment was worth repeating elsewhere, and ideas flow back and forth across the alliance it. our leadership wants to be more year. our people, are rising up against that. in the u.k., you have just had a conservative government. where are you going with that? are you going to get less europe, less welfare state? >> well, we are making some sensible welfare reforms. that is public the single best thing the new government is

doing, but the government has run up again against the reality of its eu treaty obligations. it finds that even the smallest domestic reforms turn out to be a dance some eu directive or other. last week, david cameron had this big idea. he said it is the one thing he wanted to be remembered for. it will be familiar and its theory, if not its specifics. his idea is that there is a space between society and that individual, and they should be doing lots of the things of the government is doing. we would all agree with that. he was one to fund the transition by using the money that has gone not claims in bank accounts for 25 years or something. it is just sitting there, and it currently is not doing i think. the day before he announced the policy, he was told that that

was against eu law. my point is not that you should or should not be able to access the defunct bank accounts, it is what does this have to do with the european union? how did that become across the border issue? this is what we have come up against again and again. i discovered i am obliged by eu law to keep my children in car seats until they reached that age of 12. i have been looking for to get rid of them before that. i speak of the car seat, not of the children. [laughter] on, howr side you're did it become an issue that the european union imposed on the people? that is the kind of question here state legislatures should decide on. that is the basic problem.

more than 80% of our laws are coming from brussels, from people nobody has voted for caird it is the opposite of your system. your constitution was based on the dispersal of power. the eu was based -- line 1, clause 1 of the opening treaty, on the centralization of power. from that basic design flows of the problems. i look forward to the day when the united kingdom becomes an independent country. when i have a vote on this, my hope is that my countrymen will go to reestablish sovereignty, and i look forward to forming a closer non--governmental union with the other english-speaking people. [applause] >> one we have looked at the greatest threat to freedom of the last 100 years, and who defended them, is the same names that have come up again and

again -- de united states, the united kingdom, canada, australia. that is not based on governments or treaties, or trade. i think we would be a much happier people if we rediscover our global location and our ancient friendship with you. [applause] >> time for two more. >> steve barton. i confess having spent nine months in a u.k. and a chest hospital as a student, -- nhs hospital as a student, seen some of the open wards there. is very different, but that is not my question. at the moment, the dollar is primarily the world's reserve

currency, but at the rate we are printing them, that might not last too much longer. what kind of currency might you see as the world's reserve currency if the dollar is dethroned? >> i would like to see a commodity-backed currency. >> you can watch all of the speech, and questions and answers, and our video library. we are leaving this, and taken to a roundtable discussion with a number of mayors from around the country, including tom menino from boston, and kevin johnson from sacramento. live coverage here, on c-span. >> took an emerging, national, nonprofit organization, and oversaw s potential growth and raise and invested more than $3 billion in private capital in inner-city and rural communities nationwide. other points include serving

boston's mayor's kevin white and raymond flynn, and for the past 10 years, it is 10 already -- president and ceo of the boston foundation, and one adult oldest and largest community foundations. author, a friend of community development, and one of our own extended family members, please join me in welcoming paul grogan. [laughter] [applause] >> thank you very much, richard. it is homecoming for me. the fact that this organization is so vital and so robust, and doing such great things across america is, as you would imagine, a source of great pride for me, and i do get to work lisk.-- wher

i have had a chance to see a number of you are ready, and i look forward very much to the evening, and the chance to connect some more. but, between now and this evening, we have a wonderful opportunity to hear about what is happening in urban communities from those who feel it most -- the mayors on the front lines, and we have four spectacular political -- urban, political leaders to hear from and to converse among themselves and take questions from you in due course. before i introduced them, i thought i would take the privilege of the moderator and say a few words myself. as i contemplated this session, it dawned on me that there is

both great news about cities, and bad news. when i started with kevin white, one of tom menino's of austria's predecessors, and himself a four-term mayor, i started in 1975 as a junior assistant. boston, and american cities generally were in a very different position, hemorrhaging jobs and people to the suburbs, in keeping up -- depicted again and again as a repository of unsolved problems of poverty, crime, blight, racial tensions, and so forth. cities, in no way, were synonymous with failure. as an emblem of that time, are led to tell the story about samuel hall marketplace. in 1975, kevin white and a legendary developer were trying

to get the marketplace revitalize, and they ran around to all of the great financial system -- financial institutions in baltimore -- boston. they had meetings with the ceo's everywhere they went. guess how much financing they were able to raise from boston 's home town banks and insurance companies and so forth? not a single dime. the city's business leaders were voting no on this exciting project in the historic part of the city. that is how complete and pervasive the pessimism about the american city was. in effect, they were told we understand your intentions are nothing but the best, but this will never fly. as we know now, things have really turned around. there are troubled cities still, and even the best cities have tough problems to deal with, but what a shift there has

been, both in the condition of cities, and the perception of them. we now seem to understand that over 80% of the united states population lives in metropolitan areas. 90% of the gross domestic product is produced in metropolitan areas. if the idea of the cities, the distinctiveness of urban life, has enjoyed a comeback with a significant parts of our population -- aging baby boomers, young families, young single people wanting to be in the vital cities of our land. it is an extraordinary turnaround as happened in the space of 30 years or so. i do not sit 30 years accidentally. lisk, and everything that represents has made a mighty contribution to the reality and the perception of the urban turnaround in america.

the neighborhoods that were targeted, at least the beginning, had been given up for dead, and what a story it has been to see so many of those neighborhoods blossom again. boston, my hometown, things in no small measure to the extraordinary mayor on our panel today, has become one of the most vital cities in america, it's not the world, and it is a great commercial for the difference, the distinctiveness of urban life. wewe even have books, such as te new book, of a quiet triumph of the city." how cities makes us richer, smarter, greener, and happier. these are not the kinds of books being published about cities 25 to 30 years ago. about 11 years ago, there was another optimistic book about cities -- [laughter] perhaps a little ahead of its time. we do not have to talk about that.

there is a tremendous amount of good news here that opens a great opportunities for the future. as we know, there is bad news as well, and it is right on the front page of today's "new york times." and it is below an absolutely lovely picture of elizabeth taylor. it says cutbacks in services cascade. the state budget squeeze is fast becoming a city budget squeeze, as struggling states around the nation played deep cuts in aid to cities and local governments that almost and result in more service cuts, layoffs, and local tax increases, and so forth. everyone at the four states in which our four mayors reside are in pretty significant financial trouble, and that is being passed on to them. but in kind of a terrible double jeopardy, simultaneously, the federal government appears bent on cutting the domestic discretionary spending, despite

the fact it represents only 12% of the budget. and no amount of cuts to that category of federal spending represent any kind of solution to the nation's fiscal woes. so they are dealing with that double jeopardy, and they are at the tail end of a giant game of crack the whip. one of the things we want to explore with our mayors is how they're dealing with that, how they're taking things forward in the face of such diversity, and so forth. i want to start with a question. i will give you the question and then introduce the mayors. the question is going to be, what does it feel like to be used these days? to be a mayor, getting up every morning in dealing with the issues that the city? what are the priorities and what is keeping you up at night? to address this question, we have four incredibly distinguished urban political leaders. to my immediate left is the honorable heather mcteer hudson, the mayor of greenville, mississippi.

she is a true daughter of the mississippi delta, born and raised in greenville, mississippi. she was elected mayor in 2003 and reelected for a second term in 2007. she serves as the first african- american and first female to serve in her position, and she is honored to be one of the youngest mayors within the national conference of black mayors. to her left is our major from st. paul, minnesota, whose notes i have here somewhere. mayor christopher coleman took office in 2006 and was 45 mayor of st. paul, bringing a wealth of experience to the office as an attorney, community and neighborhood leader, investment adviser, and city council member. he has been guided as his experience of a lifelong resident of st. paul. his family has deep roots in the community. he has been bridging the education gap at the core of his agenda. to his immediate left is my mayor, tom menino, who is a

political colossus. he has been reelected to his fifth consecutive four-year term, breaking the all-time record for continuous service as mayor. as i mentioned a moment ago, he has reshaped the city in countless ways, but the results are there for all to see. i was asked by a boston magazine to make a prediction for 2011 in the air in the of the year issue, and my prediction was this summer in the city this next year, the successor to mayor tom menino will be born. [laughter] finally, from the west coast, we have mayor kevin johnson of sacramento. he was elected mayor of sacramento, the 55th mayor of that city, in november 2008. he is the first native of sacramento and the first

african-american to be elected to that posed, and his vision is for sacramento to become the city that works for everyone. why don't we start with mayor john cent -- what does it feel like to be you these days? [laughter] >> pretty crappy. [laughter] [applause] i had no idea what i was getting into. [laughter] no, i am the mayor of sacramento, which is the capital of california. when i ran for mayor, there were some things that became very apparent. number one, in terms of public safety, our city was the second most violent city in california, behind only los angeles. number two, our unemployment rate was at double digits. our foreclosure rates for some of the highest in the country. again, i do not know what i was getting into. furthermore, when you think about our school system, which are the staples of good cities -- you cannot have a great city without grade schools.

the majority of our schools are not meeting the target for california. again, our schools are not working well. unemployment. people do not own homes. and our safety is an extreme challenge. on top of all that, california is one of those states that unfortunately balances -- i should say, it tends to balance its budget on the backs of cities. that is not good news for any of us. within of the challenges, there is an opportunity. in the newest mayor of chicago, rahm emanuel, when he was working for the president, said you cannot squander an opportunity and make a difference in your community. while we have a host of challenges, i think there are a lot of opportunities. but that is actually what it feels like today, it sucks. [laughter] >> mayor tom menino, same question. >> well, thank you for the introduction. as mayor of the city for the last 18 years, i still have the

excitement of being mayor. it is a challenge every day. as mayor, your life changes every hour. there challenges out there. you have budget issues. that is a big problem now. education is the biggest challenge we face. if we do not educate our children, we have no future. so as mayor, would you have to do is bring people together. great collaborations in your city to make it work. you cannot do it alone. any mayor or ceo who wants to do it alone is a failure. i, as mayor, always look to bring people in. no, the boston foundation, we asked them to help us on several issues. but one of the things we have to understand is that we have to get to the people. it is about the people. it is not t t t the issues that the folks in washington want to talk about. how do we help people every day?

how do we make sure that diversity becomes a strength for your city? that is why try every day to work with different segments of boston. because of education, public safety, and others. how do we all in america have so many handguns with young people? why can we not do something about it? [applause] i had a talk with mayor bloomberg in new york. about 350 mayors were part of this meeting. why did this -- what did not get it in washington? i do not want to give gun -- take guns away from hunters. i do not care. i want to get guns away from 13- year-old and 14-year-old. just this afternoon, a 14-year- old was killed in shot in the city. the first question, what happened, mayor? the first question should be, how did they get the guns? we have to pace -- face some of these tough issues, including

young people having guns out there. that is a real issue that the elected officials in washington do not want to deal with. why? because nra spend $2 million a year lobbying against legislation. as mayor, i get excited by the job every day. but my priority of the time is education of our children. if kids get educated, they are our future. >> thank you. mayor christopher coleman. >> i do not know if it is coincidence or by design that the four of us are all representing the city's that we were born and raised in. while i do not disagree with mayor johnson that it can feel kind of crappy at times -- [laughter] it is still pretty exciting to be the mayor of this city i was born in common use of a passionate about it. but challenging times. the easiest way to deal with it is to pretend like you did not hear what the legislature was saying. [laughter]

it is like your grandparent that would just turn their hearing aid down when the kids came over and just smiled through the whole encounter. the reality is we're sitting here at a time -- and i think it is across the country, but may be nowhere more obvious than the three largest cities. there is a specific proposal the texas state funding only for those three cities in my state in no other city. the trek to take funding away from the suburban communities. the suburban legislators got mad and they just take it away from minneapolis, st. paul, and duluth. so people ask why i am angry, and as it is not worth getting angry because it is so ridiculous. and i will pretend that those cuts are not going to come and then pretend that we were fortunate to not have the situation that you saw in wisconsin, because we did have a governor that was elected the did understand the importance of cities.

and he said he was going to put a stop to let the legislature is trying to do. we will see how it plays out. i pretended to ignore them until i actually had to deal with it. it makes me very happy. [laughter] >> thank you. >> the question you ask is how does it feel, and for me, it is humbling. i say that because, in spite of everything that is going on, we all realize that the people we represent have elected us to be leaders at such time as this. that means they put into is the level of faith, because we trust that you are going to do the right thing about the situation that we have right now. now i represent sending a little different from my colleagues, that i am the only rural community here. i represent an area in the heart of the mississippi delta. there are only three cities in the entire state that are over 50,000 people. so our entire state is rural. i know all of my friends will be

coming back to see us at high noon. you see, they know what i am talking about. everyone is now invited to the mississippi delta blues festival in greenville, mississippi the third saturday in september. [applause] but as a humbling, and take it back to the fact that in the mississippi delta, we are at generational levels of having to deal with the same problems over and over and over again. i hate to say, but to be in a recession is nothing new to us. we live in a recession. our life is a recession. the levels of poverty, the level of mass education, the level of uneconomic development that we have dealt with in our community and communities across our area are something that unfortunately we have learned to be resilient against. we have learned how to overcome. so as a mayor, for me it is

humbling that my constituents but me to a position to say, ok, we trust that you're born to do the right thing and listen to what we have to say and then take that in order to develop and form what are good resources to help us, to the next level. in the meantime, we will keep doing what we have always done, and that is we have been getting by. >> thank you. [applause] i want to ask you each with your top priority is and what you're trying to do about it at the moment. mayor menino, you have said yours. i will call on you first. it is education. you are in charge, unlike many mayors, of but the division in the city. he played a major role in passing landmark legislation last year. what has got you so excited about the education opportunity in boston right now? >> as mayor of the city, i have to appoint a school board.

it takes the politics out of the schools. we have an elected school board. all the answer to is the union's, custodians' union, teachers union, because they pay the campaign expenses to get reelected. my school board members could not get elected as dogcatcher. all they care about is the education of our children. that is what the schools should be all about. you know, this court system was in complete disarray 18 years ago, and brought in some real good superintendents of schools. they made pilot schools, which were initially -- [unintelligible] i negotiated that with the teachers' union. then i went to legislature this past due to give us flexibility in the schedules of our schools and also be able to move teachers from school to school without getting into the union nonsense. while we have to go to the

university get their roquet. also, a longer school days. we also created some programs for the diverse population of boston, like newcomer schools. when people come to boston from another country, we have a special school for those kids of the can learn english, mathematics, and reading so they can go into our system. also, the great parents universities for our parents. when we recently did was success boston. we sent a lot of kids on to college, but there were not graduating. i put a steady out there. i knew i would get my head kicked in if i wanted to see the results in black and white. so we got the results showing that only 29% of the kids graduated in four years. took them six to eight, nine years to get done. so what we did was, the foundation' group came together. we have a program for kids to

graduate from boston public schools and gone to college. we but the mine in a program in the summers of the get the benefits of understanding what to expect when they go to college. we have had that for three years. we have seen an immense improvement in what is going on with our children in the boston public schools. they come back during the course of the school year also. we have a lot of technology in our schools. that is a really important part of it. our computer labs in a lot of our schools. the president came to tech boston a couple weeks ago to see technology school and how well we are doing there. but i am tried to understand the needs of those children are. you know, education -- could go on for an hour on this one, does not start when the kid gets into the first grade. it starts when the kid is born. we have to think about how we start. start with the child is born. help them with vocabulary. have the parents read to them. make sure they get their medical

health. so they get to the fifth grade. they have all this behind them. also, we have created a four- year-old program, all they kindergarten for kids. when i became mayor, we had half a kindergarten. let me tell you what it was. the mother drop the kid off. they take their cut off. cookie and milk. set down for half an hour. the dissenting over again while the mother went to the fitness club. i said, that does not work. so we created for the kindergarten for k1 and k2. we have seen results. test scores went up. we're not perfect. we take in all our kids. the other thing i want to make perfectly clear is we have pilot schools which have negotiated with the teachers' union, regular public schools, the charter schools, parochial schools, and private schools. i do not care what school is. as long as the kid gets good education. every kid gets good education in

boston. that is all our goals. it is not about the building. it is but a child and their future. >> mayor hudson, a top priority? >> we have three major authorities. they all go together. education, that has been well- established. infrastructure and jobs. they all got together. in our area, we have had such a lack of infrastructure building that we have had to but a lot of focus on just the basic infrastructure. streets, roads, and i include broadband in that. if you do not have a good broadband infrastructure, you are not preparing the community for the next generation of jobs and economic development. in my area, we had roads and streets that had not been done for 50 years. so we put together a plan to do, in three parts, the infrastructure base. the first part was the city, to invest in our own infrastructure. we did a $10 million bond issue. now for a lot of the largest

cities, $10 million is not a lot of money. for a city with 45,000 people in it, $10 million goes a long way. we partnered that with a state program as well as with federal programs to ensure that we were leveraging those dollars. so we're the city to the $10 million to do neighborhood streets, we work with our state partners at the department of transportation to try to do state aid roads during the same time span and work with our senate delegation in order to get federal dollars to help to some of the major thoroughfares in our area. what resulted was a lot of work that happened over a short time span is actually still going on, and we could see those dollars at work, the tax dollars at work. it did a tremendous amount for our community, because neighborhood and areas that had never had street repair had an opportunity since the last to see investments happening in their neighborhoods every single

day. we saw some great things come out of that. is one of the first cities to use asphalt recycling. we're able to use and get more done with less. that is the type of things the city's need to look at in this day and age. we have been able to allow and show our industries and our businesses, hey, we're investing into our infrastructure base, investing into things that are going to continue to see our communities grow. we are investing into our neighborhoods. and we're not just doing it alone. we're partnering. we're putting together packages of how these things will help to progress our communities, as opposed to say that we're does go to put a label on a neighborhood street here. this is part of a larger group. i.v. that when we do that, i know that for our area in the mississippi delta, we are not on

the going back and correcting problems i should have been done years ago. we are properly planning and forecasting into the future the direction that we need to go. as we have a good and solid infrastructure base, we can then have a good and solid economic development base, a good, solid job space to attract jobs and to the area. from there, we can work better to, i think, really invest in our education, which is another entirely different topic but one that i think certainly needs to be explored, because education in the mississippi delta is a vital, vital need. >> thank you. mayor johnson, a top priority and what you're trying to do to move it? >> i think the economy and stimulating jobs is one in education, and hand-in-hand. i am going to piggyback on what mayor menino said. for me, it is education for our children. the end of the day, you cannot

have a great city without great schools. it has to be at the forefront of what every mayor does. no, i talked jokingly about the challenges that i got as mayor, but the opportunities are overwhelming as well. we all in the mayor menino year, because he actually controls his schools. mayor coleman and i chair and vice chair a task force that the u.s. conference of mayors, and that is in relation to arne duncan and the president. our commitment is to try to figure out within spectrum of mayor involvement in the schools this because of the basic level is mayors of money the city services with their school districts. at the end of the spectrum is where mayor's control their schools. they appoint a school board. they can avoid the superintendent. they have some influence over the budget. that is all of our dream, but we do not all of that flexibility. that is what our commitment is doing. so as a mirror on the national level, and i will bring it back to the local in a moment, we took on at the u.s. conference of mayors a very interesting policy called lifo.

have you heard about it? it is called laugh in first out. it is senior lead-based layoffs. have you heard of that? [laughter] ok, the whole room knows that one. in our country, half of the state level and have locally, you have school districts and superintendents laying off teachers based on seniority and not based on performance are quality of work. none of us would run a business or run a city when you have to make choices like that. it is not the policy for children. in relation to sacramento, we're creating a commitment or with a decision based on kids, so kids come first. number two, great teachers in every classroom. number 3, parents deserve forces could number four, you invest in what works. and number five, your reward results. that seems like no-printer type of things you should be doing, but it does not happen in most

cities around this country. we about to change that dynamic. so very specific in terms of sacramento. we believe in its portfolio of schools. we believe in all the things we have talked about up here. but i want to use their greatest the key indicator for children. in sacramento, only 39% of our third graders are reading at grade level. only 39%. what that essentially means is a 61% are not reading at grade level. if kids are not reading at grade level by the time they the third grade, 80% of those kids never catch up. how can a young person's future be decided by the time they're in third grade as we talk about this american dream? you guys know that if you cannot read, you're not going to graduate high school, you're not going to have earning power. you're not going to go to college when i can have a meaningful career. but the correlation of their grade reading ties to criminal activity.

in the sacramento, two-thirds of young people that come in contact with our judicial juvenile system, two-thirds are illiterate. so you have an environment where kids are not lit -- reading at grade level and will be involved in the penal system. that is not good. we're building presents this other great reading scores. prisons are being built based on the third grade reading scores. that is a correlation. we have a chance to disrupt that at an early age. we started a campaign in sacramento call the third grade reading. we want to create an environment that every kid in sacramento, by the time they finish third grade, can read a great level. that is big, bold, and doable. mayor menino talk about it. it starts with school readiness. attacks vested in attendance. when kids get into kindergarten through third grade. -- and it involves attendance. and then what happens during the summertime. we have a long way to go. but mayors do not have an

opportunity. a man not be in our job description, but we have a moral obligation to make sure we have an impact on our children in our schools. >> i never understood why the most powerful and top political executive is not responsible for the most important public service. but that, unfortunately, is still true in a lot of cities. mayor coleman? >> i was thinking about it. if i was to define a day in terms of how much is spent on what particular area, mayor menino would understand this better, right now it is snow plowing. [laughter] unfortunately, we have 6 inches of fresh snow on the ground at the same time that the mississippi river is headed towards a record crest the challenge for us as mayors is we want to focus in on these really important long-term structural issues, and the day-to-day step becomes overwhelming as well. education, education, education. it is absolutely critical that we integrate everything that we do, whether it is community

redevelopment, light rail, one of the largest transportation projects in the history of the state, everything we're doing in our libraries and our parks and recreation centers and with community-based groups and faith-based groups. it is alegrete to the achievement issue. minnesota is really kind of remarkable and in some ways it troubled state, because at the same time we have one of the largest rates of obtaining, one of the highest graduation rates of high school, one of the largest greats of postgraduate education, we have one of the largest achievement gaps in the country. in the twin cities region, we have the highest discrepancy in unemployment rates between the white community and communities of color than anyplace in the country. so we have this reputation as this very progressive state, this highly educated state. our economy is based on a very highly educated work force.

yeah, we have this huge achievement gap that if we do that change, the demographics are going to overwhelm the ability of the work force to work for places like boston scientific and 3m and all the other companies we have. in st. paul, same thing, i do not control the school district and i wish i had the ability to appoint the school board, as other mayors have. if nothing else, just to have a central accountability, have some same it is your responsibility to do this or to not do it. but we have also said there are some of things we can do as a city that did not involve direct time in the classroom. it is setting up the structure of of the school time programs. setting up the community-based support to make sure what is happening in the schools is reinforced during the course of the rest of the day, on the weekends, during the course of the summer. very fortunate to be one of the

committees that receive the promised neighborhood planning grants from the department of education. we're working very aggressively on making sure that we put that plan together, hopefully to receive some additional implementation funds. in addition to that focused neighborhood, promised neighborhood, is in two schools, we are dividing up the entire city into what we call learning campuses to identify all the resources that can connect to the schools to say, how can we make sure that a child who leaves the building at 3:00 or four o'clock in the afternoon as a safe place to go where they can get to drink or mentoring or get a bite to eat if that is necessary engage in extracurricular activities that relate directly and indirectly to education? it does not have to be and mathematics mentoring program or english mentoring program. but if you can incorporate some of the lessons into an art based program, if you can incorporate what is happening in the classroom into a music program or a sports program, we think we

can get lot out of existing resources if we focus them more. we wanted all of the things we do in the city of st. paul as a share of mayoral control and to say we're going to step up and play our role to make sure that there's 24 hours of support that the children need to be successful. >> thank you. going back to sort of the basic conditions under which you are operating, you all came into office, i am confident, with agendas with bold plans. but then things happened. remember, heavyweight champion mike tyson used to say everybody who fights me has a plan. then they get hit. [laughter] and the mayors get hit. you know, we talked about the cuts a little but at the start. but you feel that you spend most of your time reacting to things over which you have no control or are you able to wrestle with

that enough so that you are feeling like you can move ahead proactively and not be completely diverted from the ideas that you came into office with? who wants to answer that? >> following on your analogy, i just watched "the fighter." head, body, head, body. unfortunately, i do not know there were talking about the hits i would be taking. one of the examples as we had a program we launched in my initial year in office, 2006, and it was really to take an build on the work of some a community-based organizations and so much good work that had occurred, including our work with lisc over the years, to really take this to the next level. ok, we have stabilized your neighborhoods, so now let's make sure that when they're planning a sidewalk, a planet in a way that they connect children. seatbelts. schools. make sure they're healthy?

making sure that everything was aligned to move beyond a project here and a project there and have a comprehensive approach to neighborhood revitalization. then the mortgage foreclosure crisis hit, and boom. one step forward and about 10 steps backwards. that has been really, really deval. so even when we were able to identify resources, the game changed so dramatically with that foreclosure crisis that is just overwhelmed our ability to kind of employment those long term and, and the strategies. said any kind of stabilize through that process. and then the state cuts in the federal cuts and there were puzzled that republicans in congress have put up to strip one program away adds to the cuts. it is a constant challenge. we, as maersk, we know our

communities. we know what we could do with the resources. we, as mayoress, we know our communities. and you're dealing with the assets circumstances that you cannot control by the that is the greatest frustration of being a year right now in 2011. there are just so many forces outside of your control that you are struggling to keep up. >> anybody else? >> i think you absolutely have to keep moving forward with the old man goal in mind. also, something we're dealing with right now, gas. i mean, just because gas prices go up does not mean that your fire trucks in your police trucks do not run. they still have to run and respond. how do you deal with that? i know we had a gas prices that came before. when i first came into office, we were dealing with a $4 million budget deficit. no one knew this, including myself. you can imagine my surprise.

talk about taking a hit. you can imagine my surprise when i came in and they tell you, you do not have $4 million. you need to try to find that in order to even catch up. we were able to do it. we were able to do it. we got our budgeted to a good position. and then, what do you know, we get hit by the gas crisis. well, luckily, we had taken enough measures on the front end that we actually had funding such that we were not hit so bad that it put us back into a deficit. what are we doing now? we're looking at it, ok, how did we end of the situation before, and then, what measures did we talk about then and have we taken as measures? can we look at energy efficiency? have we look at what uses of alternative fuel sources that we have? something we have to work on, not just on the local level, but in conjunction with our state and federal associates, a looking at the fact that there were not any hybrid cars on the

state contracts. i do not know about your states. in mississippi, we typically have to go to the state confecting source first to see what the vehicles are there. then we go from there. but to look and see, ok, what were the fuel-efficient hybrid vehicles that were coming up on state contracts? there were not any. we were looking for these two and three years ago. waterways that we do not have to run as much fuel as we had to run two to three years ago? we should always be looking to seek what will be the next thing that happens, so that we do not have to continue to be reactionary but we have already started planning for what we know will come, not who we are expecting. we have been through these things before. history has shown us this is what will happen every few years in our country. so what things are we looking at and what are we prepared for? i think that is one thing is mayors that we do tend to do well.

we have to react to so much that it becomes second nature, in a sense, to look and see, all right, we're going into emergency mode. said at the command post, and let's pull out those plants that everybody was thinking about and dreaming about four and five years ago, and let's put those into practice now. >> one of the things for all of us, we all ran because we want to solve problems in our community and find solutions. what drives us crazy is when we cannot be accountable for the things that affect our communities. that is the hardest part. when we talk about schools, other than mayor menino here, we do not really have a direct opportunity in terms of accountability for our schools to your question was, what frustrates us? it is the thing that we're kelp -- held accountable for that we do not have any control over. my example would be, as mayor of sacramento, california is the eighth largest economy in the world, and use of the mayor of the capital city for california. and what happens each year is

that the state of california cannot balance its budget. said as mayors, we're all expected to balance our budget. california has a $20 billion shortfall over the last couple of years. year after year. with california best to get creative is they say, let's take money from the city's to balance the budget. they are robbing peter to pay paul. california has a two-thirds budget motion to pass a budget. if you do not get two-thirds, you're never going to get a budget passed in california. they're going to have budget reform, but that comes back. the balance it but on the backs of cities. taking a step further, california's credit rating is the worst in the country as a state. then it puts us as a city in a very awkward position where we are trying to borrow and bond and do some of the things we typically do. the reason why it is so

difficult for sacramento is we are a capital city. so the capital city, we did a double whammy. if we, as a city, have the majority of our jobs as government jobs and in california cannot balance the budget s -- and has to lay off people, that affects the whole state. when we start furloughing workers, and our workers do not come downtown and they do not spend money in our shops and restaurants. so we get a double miami in terms of california and sacramento. the last part, which is strange, we got together with the league of cities last year and said we're going to come up with the proposition, proposition 22. he clearly prohibits the state of california from taking monies. we have to have it passed overwhelmingly. that was last year. the state said, hmm, let's just eliminate redevelopment agency is now. so because they could not take money because of this

proposition, they decided to eliminate redevelopment, which basically was a loophole to take money from the cities to balance them. those are the things that make it very difficult for us as mayors. >> on the subject of mares being blamed for things that they're really do not have control over, my mentor, mayor kevin white, who spoke of earlier, although it -- always would say to me, if we're going to be blamed for things that were not our fault, let's take some credit for the good things we actually did not do. [laughter] i do not know if that works or not. >> we have 20% of the gross state revenue. we only get 19% back to the state. so we're losing revenue right there. at the local farmer does not work for capital city like boston. we had a crisis a few years ago. what i did was i went to all the unions and asked them for a pay freeze for one year so i could

get some revenues into my revenue basket so i could deal with some of the issues could also, some of my department's i asked to reorganize. it is interesting when you look at some budget, and i'll was pride myself and be in pretty good on budgets. i had my public health commission cannot 10 divisions out of the budgets, and nobody in the city recognized it. nobody complained once. because we had some items in our budget that have stayed there forever. because the executive director does nothing at all until we get a crisis stage. that is one look at these things out. also, we have gone to be state and got them to give us some opportunities to raise revenue. our meals tax and hotel tax, we never had that opportunity before. the only way i was able to finance a city was through real- estate taxes, fees and fines, and locally. your neville -- will never

figure out the local aid never until probably july, because the state legislature never passed a budget early on. as mayor, you have to understand that the budget process is the most important process. and i think that i do, as mayor, because it's your budget works, your city works. what happens a lot of times in cities is the through the budget together and just hope it works. that is the operating numbers. how do we make sure our police department, fire department, our schools all necessary funds to work public works? we do not have the schools we had in the past, but we of the schools working, the police department working, the fire department. i just went through and my bonding agencies came in three weeks ago. they give is aaa on one of the companies and aa + on another.

and we're losing almost $100 million over the last six years from state government. my financial team is probably one of the best in the country, and then know how to make it work. my department heads pay attention when i tell them you have to cut 1% to 2% of your budget the next year. we work together. they always done my favorite programs. i go over those budgets bit of a sick, why did you cut that budget? well, they know i will put it back in. so i go back and cut somebody else's budget out. we do face a crisis out there. i wish the federal government would stop this nonsense about cutting programs and look at what cities do. and listen to us, except some of these programs we have. they say, well, we will cut out cbdg.

it is a job creation program. it creates affordable housing. they said it won a cut that out. their other programs that will not cut out. listen to us, because we know, all four of us are on different lines every day. we know what has worked. listen to us. accept some of these suggestions we have as mayors. they speak to us. it is give-and-take that they ask for. what do you think? harkin musab these problems? stop, look, and listen to our federal government. be part of the solution cannot be part of the problem. >> i want to ask another question that was shifted a little bit but also ask you think about a question you might like to ask one of your fellow panelists as we go forward. that has to do with the shape of the city. i mentioned in my opening comments that i contrast to the

1970's when the city's represented everything that was bed and there was this a flight from the city's going on, significant parts of our population have really embraced and shown a preference for the distinctiveness of urban and town life. i want to ask each of you, what are you doing to try to build on that, to really enhance that urban specialness that seems to be attracted to every significant segments of the population? anybody. >> with the recent census numbers, we went up again this time. over 600,000 people who live in our city. first time over 600,000 since 1970. during the daytime, we have 1.2 million individuals to work in the city. it doubles the population. we try to make an attractive place for graduates to stay.

we retain about 5% to 6% of those graduates. 193 people from boston between the age of 20 and 34. we are a relatively young city. people have the perception we're one of the oldest cities. we are younger city because of our college and university. that is why our tourism industry keeps growing. people who live in our city. but also the challenges we have as a city is that endeavour's population, how we make them feel they're part of the mainstream of our city. over the last several years, we put 10,000 individuals through and esl program to help them be part of the mainstream and for the jobs of the city of boston. and we have the events in our city that attract people to boston, too. that is part of it. but a friendly climate that works for everybody wants to work together to make this a

city that works for not some of our people but for all of our people. that is the challenge we face is the mayor. make sure to see it is open and accepted by everyone. boston has a reputation of the 1970's. paul and i were a round in those days. it was a terrible city then. boston is much different today than a was in the 1970's. it is much more open, tolerant, and much more welcome. we as mayor said to make sure that we have the programs and have the housing to the neighborhood -- the neighborhoods have to be strong. the small business districts. the main street program. we have to make sure the work. that is what it is. it is a climate you create in your city where people say, want to live here and stay here. education is part of that. people make decisions, and it is about where the youngsters go to school. that is part of the whole criteria of what people stay in the cities and make playgrounds, streets, and all those things to the make our city work. that is what i do as mayor and i

believe my colleagues do it every day. >> when i first came in, we've put together a strategic plan with the five pillars. education, public safety, financial stability, and all those things. one would go to the end of the list, we said, there's just something missing on this. it really went to what i call the jimmy the greek intangible factor. which was, what is it that makes it unique? what is it that makes them vibrant, urban places? we added a category called the soul of this city. so if you really wanted to attract, whether it is people coming back, and the nesters moving back, people who left to go to the suburbs. how do we get them back? how do we attract businesses? so we started focusing in on trying to bring more restaurants and places to be for people in downtown. we started really focusing in on creating this great jazz festival that will rival year --

you can come in june to my jazz festival, and i will go to your blues festival in september. but those are the things. we have seen very directly the pay off. there was a major corporation that was looking to move out of the suburban community because there were trying to attract talent from across the globe. there were competing against boston, silicon valley, and against all kinds of places around the world. and wanted to come to a vibrant community. so when we can show them not only what we have done but what we're planning on doing to increase the things that would make a 25-year of graduate from mit want to come to this city of st. paul, those become critically important. i think it is one of the frustrations that i have, that people -- you hear this mantra, just focus in on the basics. the basics are not so basic. it is just not one tool in the toolbox that makes the city vibrant.

the have to be safe. the have to have jobs. the have and have great schools. but it there's nothing to do after 5:00, then people will look elsewhere to locate their businesses. they knew that activity level. the amenitiesling from a regional perspective. when i talk about downtown st. paul as a group is to look into this mess, i talk about the fact that in a couple of years, you'll be able to get on the light rail line to get to minneapolis and go to a twins game or garcia vikings game. conversely, they can come over here and go to a hockey game or what ever. part of it is focusing on specific things you're doing in your community but in understanding how this tie into a more regional perspective of all the activities you have to sell as a community. >> my perspective is going to be more from their rural site. because again, where my colleagues are in large cities, city is where you guys come to get away from intel.

[laughter] in light of that, we have seen a population decline. and it is very simple. we have seen a population decline happened at least since the 1970's and 1980's because the jobs have left. when the jobs leave, the population lives as well. the mississippi delta is primarily a minority community. the entire delta region has the largest african-american population in the entire state of mississippi, which is the largest african-american population in the united states of america. when you have seen the type of job decline we have seen over the past -- almost equivalent to the size of my city. we have got to work on bringing jobs into the community. that is where we talk about why education is so critically important, why infrastructure is so critically important. so that we can inform people so that they can live in our communities.

when we look across a broad scope, we can see that with no offense to the urban areas, there is a trend of people coming to smaller areas with the onset of broadband infrastructure, with the eve of being able to work from anywhere in the united states as well as the world, we do see people coming into small areas, small communities to live and to do business and to raise their children. there have to be benefits there, and that is certainly something we're working on in our community, providing first that infrastructure to locate the business, but then, with the benefits are. the education, the quality of life issues that moved the family. we're beginning to see some of our retirees come home. we have a joke. if you're from mississippi, then if you're from chicago, you're related to somebody from mississippi. [laughter] you just are.

because chicago is our suburb. [laughter] but we want those people to come back home. we want them to come back to mississippi. we want to see and expand that tourism that makes our culture, our area so rich. there are so many different things that are the life and blood of the mississippi delta of the people from all over the world want to come and see and experience. a quick example, there is an area right sound of tunica. how many people know where that is? that means, not just the casino. [laughter] 20 years ago, it was the most impoverished place in the entire state of mississippi. today, you go and there are 15 casinos up and down the highway. someone came up with an ingenious idea to put these as a hotelgun house this

for people to come and stay in tunica, mississippi. sure enough, you can go and the little shotgun house looks like something, something that i know from when i grow. but it is a little 1-room shotgun house complete with newspapers on the wall, complete with a little rods, beds. people come and spend $100 a night to sleep in a shotgun house. [laughter] that is crazy. but the whole idea is there is a uniqueness, i think as it was put, to all of our areas. we have to capture and understand what it is the nexus to we are, and then -- what makes us who we are, and then allow and really encourage the innovativeness of our people such that they can capitalize on their own uniqueness. that is what we're working on

doing in our area. >> when i played in the nba, my last year in the nba was 2000, and we were taking a trip on the team bus. i ask my teammates with a three tape -- favorite nba cities were common is that the three favorites. and i said what are your three least favorite nba cities, and a three least favorite in the cities -- no, they said. i did not. the not shoot the messenger. salt lake city, milwaukee, and sacramento. and i went, oh, sacramento. why sacramento? and they said, you are the capital of california. at 5:00 downtown, there is nothing open. how can you be a capital of california and not have any restaurants or shops open past 5:00? furthermore, they said, we play again that ends at 10:00, and by the time we get back to the hotel, we have to order

reservist because you all do not have any restaurants. the irony is, it is probably right -- why ran for mayor -- [laughter] i want to make a sacramento not in the bottom tier of nba studies, but it is as simple as people are making decisions to do not just on jobs. they want to live in a cool place to the end of the day, the millennium, they're making decisions on where to live based on cool cities. i think that is where we're trying to find that balance of, yes to jobs and cultural activities, said it amenities. we have two rivers in sacramento. two rivers. anybody here from san antonio, before i say this? [laughter] san antonio. they are known for a river. it is not a river. it is a canal. [laughter] they pump water down this canal. the have marketed it brilliantly as a river walk. we have two rivers, and we're

doing nothing about it. so there are opportunities that a very unique to our communities. >> my friend michael porter at the harvard business school has remarked on the current internet revolution when anything can be done from anywhere, the distinctiveness of place matters even more. i think it is realism. now i would like to invite you mayors to ask each other some questions. mayor johnson, do have a -- mayor hudson, do have a question for one of your fellow mayors? >> i guess my question actually would go to my colleague here from boston. you sit in a very unique position of having control over the school board, and i think that is one of the things that was expressed as something that a lot of us do not have the ability to do.

how did you first got out setting the priorities that needed to happen within your school system in conjunction with what your constituents were saying it needed to happen in the school system? >> my predecessor fought for it. i came into office. there was a sunset clause this that we had to go before the voters to make it permanent. at that time, the school members were throwing ashtrays at each other, skilling speeches. the school system was in complete disarray. one went to jail. education was not the important thing. the custodian was important. the teachers' union was very important. the kids were the least important part.

when i came into office, we took a poll, and i was losing. they said, i cannot retain the ability to appoint the school board. i went to the business community, and they said if you raise the money, i am going to win. i had to convince the minority community that we were giving the right to children to education. by the time we got to the election date, we turn it round and won. we got a lot of folks in the community to understand how important this was. i just say that i was very happy with the decision, and there was a lot of progress. we think about public education and public school systems.

we take all kids in. handicapped kids, every kid out there comes to the boston public schools. we have to make sure all our schools accept all our kids. there have been reforms, and i think we will be able to get all the schools to take all those kids in. paul and i disagree on the charter school issue at times. they choose or pick who they want. under the new education reform bill, they will not be able to choose or pig. because what they were doing was cherry picking. in april, of the kid was going to graduate, they would throw the book to the boston public schools. a in june at the big press conference, they say, all our kids graduated and are going to college. well, they're back with me again. with legislation, we will be able to deal with that issue.